Mazuko

Of all of the news I have read on many websites about the devastation of Hurricane Katrina on Louisana and Mississippi I have not heard mention of international aid a single time.

I have heard we are pulling troops home from Iraq to help aid in the relief. We are sending TWO air craft carriers to help with the relief effort. We are asking the American people to donate even the most minute amount of money to help the victims of this natural disaster.

Aside from foreign governments saying "Our hearts and souls go out to the American people affected by this disaster." I have not yet come across a single nation offering us AID. I don't really care about monetary aid in as much as SEARCH PARTIES! I mean for god's sakes there is at least 26 miles of coast line that is now underwater in Mississippi alone! How many thousands are trapped in New Orleans?

Yes there is looting and rioting and the such in New Orleans, but our men and women in blue are doing their best in such a shit hole of a situation. I heard on the news this morning that they have to find food and water for themselves in New Orleans as the police station is gone. Their police force is having to syphon gasoline from abandoned vehicles just so they can keep patrolling. They have to get into groups of 8 or more just to survive! Hell even a national guardsman was shot and wounded yesterday and an evacuation chinook helicopter from the US Army was shot at as it moved refugees out of the city!

This is outrageous and appaling. It is appaling that the citizens of New Orleans react to a situation like this in the manner they are. I am outraged that every single country effected by the Tsunami or hurricanes, or FLOODS, or starvation, asks us for aid. However when we have a situation like this....I haven't even READ on the internet, magazines, newspapers or seen on TV any sort of international response whatsoever.

To accuse the US for being "cheap" and not sending ENOUGH MONEY to aid the tsunami victims and to turn around and do this to us after we sent more, is bullshit. Pure bullshit. I'm doing my part by donating money, food, supplies. What is the international community doing in response?

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Mazuko

Just a follow up to my post:

This is what the Europeans have done in response.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlates...245983,00.html

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Sandok

Dude the US is the richest country in the world... You guys are powerful enough to help yourselves. I feel sadness for you guys but I don't really see how more money will help you... Here where I am there is no way for me (I AM very young ) to send money easily. I mean, with the tsunami thing there were tons of people everywhere askin for money but well, not the same for the US.

Anyways, I think you guys will be able to help the people stranded in to time. Hopefully, the city can be saved (great place) but that was sorta a disaster waiting to happen.

violat3

actually UK, France, Germany, Spain, Italy, Russia etc offered America assistance in the area and all offers of help were told were not needed by bush & his goverment .... he is more interested in self pride than accepting help from friends, i would think he would be happy to accept help in such a massive tragedy .... saving lives are far more important than pride Mr Bush people are dieing while you refuse our offers of help

Zardon

im actually more surprised the USA people don't appear to be doing more, I saw this on the news and very little seems to be happening in regards to relief......... perhaps im wrong just going on the sky reports.

mike2h

the main problem is that there are hundreds of sq miles of area that are destroyed & tens of thousands of displaced & devestated people to deal with. all without endangering the people you send in. & the area of flooding along the coast is more like a 100miles. then there is all the flooding further inland.
however i do not understand why they do not have help for those thousands of people at the NO convention center. at this point they can not possibly be everywhere at once, but they have a very large group of starving & sick people in a know location & have not sent them any help.
as far as foreign aid goes, outside of $$ help, getinng physical assets here takes time. not sure how viable that is.

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mike2h

this should settle this 'debate' - http://go.reuters.com/newsArticle.jh...ss/scienceNews

my personal thx to these & any other supporting country.

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Falstaff

The problem is that the governer of Louisiana was directly responsible for a cascade response with her local resources to administer aid and relief for New Orleans if just such a disaster occurred. Several days before Katrina blew through people were warned, and warned again, many chose to stay for whatever reason because they were required to or they felt they had the resources. Everyone knew that the levee could break and it did (Led Zeppelin playing) so agencies first waited for the response by the local government.
Assessments were made, and the first responders and trucks began rolling, helicopters that could respond did. Law was not restored and disaster mechanisms that looked good on paper did not materialize and now the U.S. government and FEMA are racing to the area.
Getting in and out of New Orleans is problamatic at best in a safe manner, if you have ever been to that area you will know that it is damn hard to get in and out of there even on a good day.
They highway systems were never made to handle the immense traffic leaving or entering the city now that highway going over the lake is now down. Violent activity and lawlessness have hampered what promised to be speedy relief for many stranded at the superdome.
New Orleans will get aid and relief, but nothing can be readily accomplished till people are moved out and able bodied men and women are pressed in efforts to relieve themselves.
I was disgusted by looters claiming that nothing had been done for them, as they robbed stores of color TVs and brandished weapons, while their own families suffered appalling conditoins.
New Orleans has a dark side, a culture of excess and exploitation and just plain irreverance for authority anyway so I am not surprised that it is hard to marshall the community at large there in any effort to dig or float themselves out.

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mike2h

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while i have not been there myself i have heard the same thing from many other people. i also share you sentiments about the looters.

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Falstaff

It is appalling that the BBC has chosen to blame this whole thing on President Bush, and it is just typical of the British press. There is just no "knee jerk" response by anyone that can amilerate this situation, it will take a focused and direct response that can be sustained that will make the biggest difference.

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TJ-

No your right, that seems to be the picture im getting from all the repots im seeing. They are sending in thousands on national guard troops, but that doesnt feed or help people who need medical attention. IMO makes it worse.

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Falstaff

Again it is damn left wing media, trying to pin this whole thing on someone....
I just had to turn the idiot box off when I heard self proclaimed investigatory journalists try to pin the total cost for the entire relief on the Bush Administration...

You know who messed this up....years and years of poor management in New Orleans and Louisiana...
Now President Bush must ensure that extraordinary efforts are taken in light of the vacumn of the local response by the state where the disaster occured.

New Orleans and Katrina are synonymous with PPP.....
Piss Poor Planning..

just a quick note....as of this time, the Mayor of New Orleans is still trying to get his act together..you want to direct frustration at any one individual I suggest this person....he can only manage an SOS.

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Master Shake

Tourist Debbie Durso of Washington, Mich., said she asked a police officer for assistance and his response was, "'Go to hell _ it's every man for himself.'"

"All I want to say to Mayor Ray Nagin is thank you for helping us," Yolanda McZeal, 43, said calmly, sarcastically and bitterly. "Governor Blanco, thank you for helping us. President Bush, thank you for helping us."

"I think there ought to be zero tolerance of people breaking the law during an emergency such as this _ whether it be looting, or price gouging at the gasoline pump, or taking advantage of charitable giving or insurance fraud," Bush said. "And I've made that clear to our attorney general. The citizens ought to be working together."

Outside a looted Rite-Aid drugstore, some people were anxious to show they needed what they were taking. A gray-haired man who would not give his name pulled up his T-shirt to show a surgery scar and explained that he needs pads for incontinence.

"I'm a Christian. I feel bad going in there," he said.

Earl Baker carried toothpaste, toothbrushes and deodorant. "Look, I'm only getting necessities," he said. "All of this is personal hygiene. I ain't getting nothing to get drunk or high with."

Donald Dudley, a 55-year-old New Orleans seafood merchant, complained that when he and other hungry refugees broke into the kitchen of the convention center and tried to prepare food, the National Guard chased them away.

"They pulled guns and told us we had to leave that kitchen or they would blow our damn brains out," he said. "We don't want their help. Give us some vehicles and we'll get ourselves out of here!"



http://www.comcast.net/news/index.j.../01/212898.html

Falstaff

I just heard an interview with Chief of Police and the director of Homeland Security in New Orleans and they both stated that situation was not hopeless, and that they should have had vehicles that can operate in deep water, their officers are fighting crime on the streets without food and water themselves. They are doing what they can themselves and they are not pointing fingers or bitching about what President Bush should be doing, they are asking people to pull together and begin their own relief on the ground now. They are going after that 1 to 2 percent of the native population with what ever they have to get order back on the streets and that unfortunately is the reality.
I think the pitiful testimony of the victems of the storm and the flood can only serve to fuel efforts to bring more relief from agencies and corporations outside the area.
Ironically, the corporations that were affected by the disaster that operated in New Orleans are pouring their money into diverting shipping, oil and construction into alternative sites to continue to supply of commodities they manufacture.
New Orleans will lose tremendous economic captial in the years to come. New Orleans will no doubt be wiped clean in some areas and rebuilt upon foundations of stone.
New Orleans will never recover to its former self without years and years of planning and reconstruction.
If anyone knows the history of the city it has gone through changes in the past and weathered harsh storms and the optimism that created it has endured...but I fear the optimism now es misplaced, because the very mechanisms people trusted to help them get back on their feet no longer exist. Residents of this old city will have to have a great deal of courage and patience if they intend to continue to live here....
I am afraid like Venice, New Orleans will have to rethink its future and measure its survival in yards of coastline daily, because the sea is reclaiming New Orleans every single minute of every day.
People are not giving up on New Orleans or its inhabitants, but here is just another sad chapter in the journal of bad planning and poor execution in America's history, hopefully the news will focus on the rescues and praise the rescuers and the people that stayed and fought for peace and kept they faith long enough to see the streets dry up and the water and food flow back into this town.

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SFOSOK

Its a bad time, guess no more Mardi Gra for awhile. My moronic brother tried to blame this on the judicial system. He has zero brains (used to be Army Infantry, and blames bush for everything) and is such a tool. I think the blame cannot be placed on one thing. Its a large combination of the state and city gov not forcing every single person to leave. Its hard for me to believe how a person would think they are proving something, or could save their home if they stayed. They should have left when they had the chance, and now most can't. I was watching Fox News and the reporter showed the scene around him and then showed a man dead on the ground who was covered up with clothing by people who had passed him by. 1,000 people may not sound like a lot (just a statistic right) but think of that as all the clostest people you hold dear to your and multiply it by 100. I don't think people quiet yet understand. It will be blamed on the government (because everything is). Very sad, as an American and a human, to hear stories and watch this happen. It's a damn shame, but maybe people can learn from it and get the hell out of their city when they are told to.

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SFOSOK

If there is no order than the supplies will be looted. Security comes first. People can live over a week without water, but they can't live more than a couple hours after being raped and beaten to near death. Once we get a standing force and the thugs have been stopped, then and only then should we supply anyone who has not been evacuated. There have been reports of women being beaten and strangled in the bathrooms at the superdome, so if I were to starve for a couple days or be shot while I'm eating, I'll go with the first option.

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Falstaff

It isnt that there is not food or water being delivered, but it is dangerous on the ground at this time. there were only 100 police officers in the Superdome while 30,000 people remain within the area, demanding federal aid or worse yet, threatening others with weapons. Even hospitals cannot operate amublances because the thugs are threatening them on the street and demanding transportation out of the area, denying patients and victims any support at all on the streets unless they have armed escorts or police.

The federal response will be massive, and the greatest impact will not be readily apparent until the waters subside on the streets of New Orleans and those that have dwellings that remain can get back to the business of restoring them or moving their belongings out.

I can see now why the estimated deathtoll for the entire disaster will reach in the thousands..

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Ubergrendle

For what its worth... there's been lots of international assisstance offered, but so far Bush has turned it down.

I can understand why... the situation is still fluid, control isn't absolute and they're still trying to evaluate the situation. Canadian troops aren't going to help much, just add to the chaos. We've had DART (Diaster Area Response Team) ready since Tuesday morning... they specialise in medical aid, shelter construction, and are world leaders in emergency water purification -- they'll be on the ground in 6-12 hrs as soon as word is given.

Right now i suspect the widespread destruction of infrastructure (roads, power, communications) is limiting the response...also its tough to get close to NO given all the flooding.

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Falstaff

the only person I think he chose to publicaly decline help from was Chavez..

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mike2h

i dont think so, but it is hard to find out wat is true & what isnt. chavez has offered more oil at a reduced price, i cant see then turning that one down. but who knows?

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raid517

Well I have kind of retired from the political section - as I have other things on my plate right now. But I thought I would just post this once to say sorry and pass on my condolances. I am not sure where the perception comes from that no one is offering aid, as right now on my TV and on the radio there are appeals going on all the time - and also there are lots of people on the streets rattling tin cans asking for donations. I think possibly it comes from the fact that a lot of Americans don't read anything or watch any news reports from outside of their own media - but I assure you just as was the case with 9/11, huge amounts of aid are being gathered - and that this will be distributed to victims as soon as is practically possible.

With regard to the looters - I think there is too much focus on what is really a very small criminal ellement. (Indeed the 'right wing media' are playing this up just so white folks don't need to feel so guilty about not offering help). There is no law and order there right now and even the police a have said that it is a matter of everyone for themselves. But really this should not be used as an excuse to re-enforce anyone's already innate racism. Even a senior police officer has said in an interview I watched tonight that the official policy is that if they see someone taking food or water or clothing from a store then the police should just wave them on - but if they take TV's or try to steal cars etc they should be shot.

Personally in my view I can't see why they didn't get the army, or the police to crack open the shopping malls and the stores and distribute whatever food and water there was at the earliest possible opportunity. Of course people are stealing food - because no one is bringing any food to them - and no one seems to be in any hurry to try to rescue them. They are completely desperate. You would steal too if you had kids and were starving and filthy and hadn't had a drink of water in nearly 6 days.

It would be utterly unforgivable though I think if you were to send in the Army after starving people and leaving them without water and appearing to abandon them for so long, and then tell them to shoot people for stealing food and water and clothing. It would risk making it appear as though they were being killed for just trying to help themselves, particularly when it seems that no one else is prepared to do anything to help them. First you leave people (including young children and old people) behind to die - and then you send in the army to shoot them when they become desperate? I don't think that would play well in the media at all. (Not in any media - both left and right).

Anyway here is and interesting story of how events are unfolding. I'm sure Jeff might not like it, as typically he appears to place George Bush above all repproach. I don't particularly feel though that it is blaming anyone specifically - but it does blame everyone in authority equally and does seem to show that there is a general lack of concern in America for the poor black population of it's cities.

You have to bare in mind that the people who left were in general the people who could afford to leave - which tended to be the white middle classes with jobs and money and cars and other places to go - while many of those who stayed just did not have any of these things - or were too frail, or too sick to leave - while still others believed (as had happend so often in the past) that the worst of the storm would simply pass them by.

I don't think you should play politics too much with this though - as no one can really be to blame for a storm (not even George W. Bush) but it does seem to be genuinely shocking just how unconcerned the authorities were (both local and national) about the extent of the disaster and how slow they were (and still are) to do anything about it. It is almost as though just because the majority of these people are poor and black, that most people in America (or at least those in power) simply couldn't care less. It is inconcevable that there would be a similar response if a disaster like this occured in a mainly white/middle class town. It just wouldn't be allowed to happen.

Anyway, my heart goes out to the victims and everyone who is still trapped there. I hope relief reaches them soon and that they can perhaps one day at least recover some part of their devastated lives.

Best regards,

GJ

SFOSOK

Maybe some people will finally learn that its not about oil anymore.

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Dark Lord

just heard today that the National Guard now has orders to "Shoot to kill" for all looters, theives, and rapists.

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SFOSOK

Good news, hope it spreads to the looters (not the rapists, because they should not be allowed to live).

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Sandok

Rapists are evil... Totally. I just hope that everything gets smoothened out and starts workin well.

Necrosis

I seen tons of a examples for international support. Heck, Europe wants to send us gas. I've also made my own personal donation to help out. In about a week or so I'll be helping restore the communication down there. For example one of our customer's "Sprint/Nextel" has 700 cell sites down. So far they only have 10 back up. Not to mention from my state alone there are huge National Guard conveys heading down state route 71 & 75.

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GOG

If I wasn't such a peaceful nature, I would say: Every person using a disaster like this one for his/her own economical benefit should be shot on sight.

When the tsunami hit Thailand the inhabitants helped the tourists.

When Katrina hit USA, the inhabitants start to loot the nearest gun shop and rob the tourists.

Gabriel_Etranil

Everybody knows that Katrina was caused by George Bush's evironmental policies, well that's what the press is reporting anyway.

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Sandok

Which is not true since global warming is not because of only 1 country's attitude but this is a consequence none the less of refusing kyoto agreement. Hope you guys cfhanged your mind young america

mike2h

yet again you get it wrong.

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