U.S. Not The Only Ones With Problems

digerati · Mar 10, 2005, 10:28 PM

Japan
(Kyodo) _ A 49-year-old woman was arrested on suspicion of killing her 11-year-old son Thursday before attempting to commit suicide, saying she has been annoyed by her husband's business failure and arrest, police said.

"Because I felt it would be pitiful to leave the child alone, I strangled him when he was sleeping," Shizu Yamagata was quoted by the police as saying, admitting to killing Teppei, an elementary school boy, at their home in Higashiosaka, Osaka Prefecture.

Her husband ran a bar in Higashiosaka but closed it in August last year because business was bad. He was arrested in February on suspicion of confining a person in a car after a quarrel at a "pachinko" gaming parlor, the police said.

The woman cut her wrist with a kitchen knife, but is not in serious condition, they said.

Her 76-year-old mother, who lives with her, called the police after finding the boy lying in the futon bedding shortly after 5 a.m. and being told by her daughter that she had killed the boy.

Paramedics went to their home at around 5:40 a.m. and took the boy to a hospital, where he was pronounced dead.

The police at first arrested the woman on suspicion of attempted murder and plan to switch the charge to murder, they said.

-------------------------------------------------

Suicide rates have been climbing in Japan. When I asked my friend why it had been on the rise, he said that it was because society put so much pressure on economic status that if you lost your money the common feeling was that you failed at life and it was time to go.

I thought this would be good for this forum to see that America isn't the only one with problems, every country has their problems for different reasons.

Also, while we may have a high suicide rate with guns I'm told Japan has a high suicide rate with trains because guns aren't sold as freely. If this is correct then it shows yet another counter to the liberal fantasy of guns being the cause of suicide and deaths.

Dark Lord · Mar 10, 2005, 10:39 PM

quite honestly im not suprised at all. you can look in any location and find something like this if you just look around a bit.

and just remember, its down the road and not across the street.

raid517 · Mar 10, 2005, 10:41 PM

Well Guns do kill people that much isn't in doubt. There isn't much practical use, for most guns - particularly hand guns and automatic weapons. Hunting guns you can kind of get - but these other guns only have one single purpose. I mean what other purpose is a hand gun useful for? Maybe shooting the lights out when you are too drunk to get up and turn them off?

But I doubt you will ever take the guns out of America. So I don't think it's much of a debate.

As for the story. That is just a sad and tragic tale - though it isn't much to do with suicide. It was a murder plain and simple. She did make a lame attempt to kill herself I guess. But clearly she didn't try hard enough.

If people are going to kill themselves I'm sure they will find a way to do it one way or another.

GJ

[)arkNova · Mar 10, 2005, 10:43 PM

Good read. I believe many liberals will read this and blame America somehow I'm sure. Everything is america's fault to liberals.Perfection? What is that anyway?

[)arkNova · Mar 10, 2005, 10:45 PM

Last time I checked,guns don't have brains,people do. I learned that when I was about 2years old.

raid517 · Mar 10, 2005, 11:19 PM

Sometimes people with guns have no brains. You may not need to pass an IQ test to shoot a gun, but you should almost certainly be made to pass a test in order to own a one.

GJ

digerati · Mar 10, 2005, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raid517

Sometimes people with guns have no brains. You may not need to pass an IQ test to shoot a gun, but you should almost certainly be made to pass a test in order to own a one.

GJ

I wouldn't be against that.

The_Neon_Cowboy · Mar 10, 2005, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raid517

Well Guns do kill people that much isn't in doubt. There isn't much practical use, for most guns - particularly hand guns and automatic weapons. Hunting guns you can kind of get - but these other guns only have one single purpose. I mean what other purpose is a hand gun useful for? Maybe shooting the lights out when you are too drunk to get up and turn them off?

But I doubt you will ever take the guns out of America. So I don't think it's much of a debate.

As for the story. That is just a sad and tragic tale - though it isn't much to do with suicide. It was a murder plain and simple. She did make a lame attempt to kill herself I guess. But clearly she didn't try hard enough.

If people are going to kill themselves I'm sure they will find a way to do it one way or another.

GJ

Was the topic guns?

BTW: people kill people not guns... take guns out of the equation people stil die just by a diffent means, unless you plan to stap everyone to gurneys and call it freedom

... other wise thier going to kill each other... those that would hae ued guns...

anyways hand guns are legal and quite well for hunting... much better the lugging in a shotgun... especally with 40-50lbs on your back you don't need an extra 10lbs in your hands.. climing up hill on a muddy slope at 4-5 oclock in the morning

antomatic weapons (semi auto kind assult) and rifiles are legal use in some area but you seem to think they avialable in every sore automatic weapoms are rare hard to find and even then verry hard to buy and to even get the licence required to buy. any adult can get a shotgun or rifle but hand guns... again a specail licence... for hunting or protection...

raid517 · Mar 10, 2005, 11:42 PM

It still seems silly and irresponsible that in many instances obtaining a gun is easier than obtaining a driving licence.

GJ

The_Neon_Cowboy · Mar 10, 2005, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raid517

It still seems silly and irresponsible that in many instances obtaining a gun is easier than obtaining a driving licence.

GJ

It requires a drivers licence , a big long arse form, and a FBI backgruond check on the spot and thas for all guns.... takes 30-45min... I know becouse I used to sell them @ one of the various places i've worked

Illegal guns thats alother story... and thier not much good you can do about those... excpet when people are cought with them they get in alot of trouble... but law abideing citzens shouldn't be punised for the few deviants wich have already made it alot harder to buy guns

raid517 · Mar 11, 2005, 12:10 AM

Filling in a form is hardly a measure of intelligence or fitness to own a firearm. And an awful lot of people seem to get through the loop when it comes to background checks. Not all of the guns (indeed I'd guess that it was fairly even) that are used in crimes are illegally owned. But hey I'm not saying you guys should give up your guns. It would be very nice if you did - but I just don't think you will. There are too many of them and you seem to love them too much. There would probably be another civil war if anyone really tried to take them away. (Though half of you would probably die in gun accidents, as opposed to being shot by an FBI operative, or government agent - or whatever).

Well anyway, your picking on the wrong guy to debate with. The gun thing isn't something I think is worth raking over. It doesn't really interest me that much.

GJ

Falstaff · Mar 11, 2005, 12:12 AM

after living in Japan for six years I can understand why some would choose suicide in light of their economic plight, but most I gather do not relish the thought of killing themselves...

BWX · Mar 11, 2005, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raid517

Well Guns do kill people that much isn't in doubt. There isn't much practical use, for most guns - particularly hand guns and automatic weapons. Hunting guns you can kind of get - but these other guns only have one single purpose. I mean what other purpose is a hand gun useful for? Maybe shooting the lights out when you are too drunk to get up and turn them off?

But I doubt you will ever take the guns out of America. So I don't think it's much of a debate.

As for the story. That is just a sad and tragic tale - though it isn't much to do with suicide. It was a murder plain and simple. She did make a lame attempt to kill herself I guess. But clearly she didn't try hard enough.

If people are going to kill themselves I'm sure they will find a way to do it one way or another.

GJ

Why are you so infatuated with America?

radTube · Mar 11, 2005, 05:18 AM

Was this really supposed to be about (american) gun laws? I thought there is/was one thread about them already. But anyway, the article really doesn't prove anything else that humans aren't perfect, and neither are societies, due to consisting of human beings. Hardly worth a thread, this notion.

If you wanted to discuss the seemingly weird Japanese mentality, that's another matter. Not that its 'nonwestern' and confusing values are a surprise, if you consider the way the country has in an extremely short time period mixed its traditional samurai-era values with ultramodern, very much hollywood-influenced pop-culture. Not a very compatible match there. Those ancient, strict morals go pretty far in explaining even the high suicide rates.

By the way, suicide rates hardly give any indication about the political or cultural advancedness of any given nation, unless you consider countries like Jordan, Iran, or Syria to be great examples of modern, civilised countries (which I doubt many Americans or indeed other westerners do). They just happen to be among the countries with least suicides according to World Health Organization statistics. The other end is populated with ex soviet countries, with Japan and Finland holding the positions 11 and 12 respectively.

raid517 · Mar 11, 2005, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWX

Why are you so infatuated with America?

Lol, I'm not really. I'm just being polite. After all if we didn't talk about America, what exactly would most of you guys have to talk about?

Besides this thread is about America not being the only country with problems. When you do comparisions like this (particularly when it's in the title). it's kind of hard to ignore one half of the comparision.

GJ

stamvas · Mar 13, 2005, 08:46 AM

America started with guns. It's in your own hands that you will not continue solving problems with guns (though there are so many signs that something like this is not going to happen).
Guns is the culture of US.

BWX · Mar 13, 2005, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stamvas

America started with guns. It's in your own hands that you will not continue solving problems with guns (though there are so many signs that something like this is not going to happen).
Guns is the culture of US.

So is freedom to own them..

stamvas · Mar 13, 2005, 07:35 PM

I can't understand why is it so desperately needed to own a gun. Are you so threatened? Who are you afraid of? Maybe the community you have built there?
I never felt like owning a gun and I don't feel any threats upon me. Of course where I live at is far away from the American reality. Maybe you Americans have your reasons to feel so. Maybe people are killing and not the guns, but people have manufactured guns in order to kill, so thats what they're made for. Someone who got a gun needs to kill even if he pretends not to.

regards

BWX · Mar 13, 2005, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stamvas

I can't understand why is it so desperately needed to own a gun. Are you so threatened? Who are you afraid of? Maybe the community you have built there?
I never felt like owning a gun and I don't feel any threats upon me. Of course where I live at is far away from the American reality. Maybe you Americans have your reasons to feel so. Maybe people are killing and not the guns, but people have manufactured guns in order to kill, so thats what they're made for. Someone who got a gun needs to kill even if he pretends not to.

regards

Oh so maybe we should outlaw baseball bats and knives too?
Oh wait- people get pushed out of windows, maybe we should make windows illegal?

radTube · Mar 14, 2005, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWX

Oh so maybe we should outlaw baseball bats and knives too?
Oh wait- people get pushed out of windows, maybe we should make windows illegal?

Did you even read the post you quoted? To me it seems like he wanted to know what makes you feel threatened enough to need a firearm. And anyway, are you saying that baseball bats and windows are 'manufactured in order to kill'?

BWX · Mar 14, 2005, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by radTube

Did you even read the post you quoted? To me it seems like he wanted to know what makes you feel threatened enough to need a firearm. And anyway, are you saying that baseball bats and windows are 'manufactured in order to kill'?

Kill what? A gun can be used for target practice, hunting, etc...
People kill people, guns don't kill people.

stamvas · Mar 14, 2005, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWX

Kill what? A gun can be used for target practice, hunting, etc...
People kill people, guns don't kill people.

I'm absolutely convinced that guns were made for shooting target practice

ABSOLUTELY

BWX · Mar 14, 2005, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stamvas

I'm absolutely convinced that guns were made for shooting target practice

ABSOLUTELY

Good, because many are.

Mar 10, 2005, 10:28 PM	#1
digerati Everyones life has worth Join Date: May 2003 Location: My Yellow Bug Posts: 3,780 Rep Power: 47	U.S. Not The Only Ones With Problems Japan (Kyodo) _ A 49-year-old woman was arrested on suspicion of killing her 11-year-old son Thursday before attempting to commit suicide, saying she has been annoyed by her husband's business failure and arrest, police said. "Because I felt it would be pitiful to leave the child alone, I strangled him when he was sleeping," Shizu Yamagata was quoted by the police as saying, admitting to killing Teppei, an elementary school boy, at their home in Higashiosaka, Osaka Prefecture. Her husband ran a bar in Higashiosaka but closed it in August last year because business was bad. He was arrested in February on suspicion of confining a person in a car after a quarrel at a "pachinko" gaming parlor, the police said. The woman cut her wrist with a kitchen knife, but is not in serious condition, they said. Her 76-year-old mother, who lives with her, called the police after finding the boy lying in the futon bedding shortly after 5 a.m. and being told by her daughter that she had killed the boy. Paramedics went to their home at around 5:40 a.m. and took the boy to a hospital, where he was pronounced dead. The police at first arrested the woman on suspicion of attempted murder and plan to switch the charge to murder, they said. ------------------------------------------------- Suicide rates have been climbing in Japan. When I asked my friend why it had been on the rise, he said that it was because society put so much pressure on economic status that if you lost your money the common feeling was that you failed at life and it was time to go. I thought this would be good for this forum to see that America isn't the only one with problems, every country has their problems for different reasons. Also, while we may have a high suicide rate with guns I'm told Japan has a high suicide rate with trains because guns aren't sold as freely. If this is correct then it shows yet another counter to the liberal fantasy of guns being the cause of suicide and deaths.

Mar 10, 2005, 10:43 PM	#4
[)arkNova DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 99 Rep Power: 0	Good read. I believe many liberals will read this and blame America somehow I'm sure. Everything is america's fault to liberals.Perfection? What is that anyway? __________________ [color=blue]Barton 2500 @ 202 X 11 [/color] [color=red]@ 1.675V[/color] [color=deepskyblue]1Gb of 3200 cosair @ 404 [/color] [color=red]@ 2.7V[/color] [color=blue]AN35N Ultra[/color] [color=deepskyblue]9600xt 550/660[/color] [color=blue]Thermaltake pipe 101 @ 42C/31C[/color] [color=red]Fortron 530W[/color]

Mar 10, 2005, 10:45 PM	#5
[)arkNova DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 99 Rep Power: 0	Last time I checked,guns don't have brains,people do. I learned that when I was about 2years old. __________________ [color=blue]Barton 2500 @ 202 X 11 [/color] [color=red]@ 1.675V[/color] [color=deepskyblue]1Gb of 3200 cosair @ 404 [/color] [color=red]@ 2.7V[/color] [color=blue]AN35N Ultra[/color] [color=deepskyblue]9600xt 550/660[/color] [color=blue]Thermaltake pipe 101 @ 42C/31C[/color] [color=red]Fortron 530W[/color]

Mar 11, 2005, 12:10 AM	#11
raid517 DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,518 Rep Power: 0	Filling in a form is hardly a measure of intelligence or fitness to own a firearm. And an awful lot of people seem to get through the loop when it comes to background checks. Not all of the guns (indeed I'd guess that it was fairly even) that are used in crimes are illegally owned. But hey I'm not saying you guys should give up your guns. It would be very nice if you did - but I just don't think you will. There are too many of them and you seem to love them too much. There would probably be another civil war if anyone really tried to take them away. (Though half of you would probably die in gun accidents, as opposed to being shot by an FBI operative, or government agent - or whatever). Well anyway, your picking on the wrong guy to debate with. The gun thing isn't something I think is worth raking over. It doesn't really interest me that much. GJ Last edited by raid517; Mar 11, 2005 at 06:22 AM.

Mar 11, 2005, 12:12 AM	#12
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 18,137 Rep Power: 131	after living in Japan for six years I can understand why some would choose suicide in light of their economic plight, but most I gather do not relish the thought of killing themselves... __________________ The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut by the scythe.

Mar 10, 2005, 10:39 PM	#2
Dark Lord DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 5,582 Rep Power: 66 System Specs	quite honestly im not suprised at all. you can look in any location and find something like this if you just look around a bit. and just remember, its down the road and not across the street.

Mar 10, 2005, 10:41 PM	#3
raid517 DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,518 Rep Power: 0	Well Guns do kill people that much isn't in doubt. There isn't much practical use, for most guns - particularly hand guns and automatic weapons. Hunting guns you can kind of get - but these other guns only have one single purpose. I mean what other purpose is a hand gun useful for? Maybe shooting the lights out when you are too drunk to get up and turn them off? But I doubt you will ever take the guns out of America. So I don't think it's much of a debate. As for the story. That is just a sad and tragic tale - though it isn't much to do with suicide. It was a murder plain and simple. She did make a lame attempt to kill herself I guess. But clearly she didn't try hard enough. If people are going to kill themselves I'm sure they will find a way to do it one way or another. GJ

Mar 10, 2005, 11:19 PM	#6
raid517 DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,518 Rep Power: 0	Sometimes people with guns have no brains. You may not need to pass an IQ test to shoot a gun, but you should almost certainly be made to pass a test in order to own a one. GJ

Mar 10, 2005, 11:42 PM	#9
raid517 DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,518 Rep Power: 0	It still seems silly and irresponsible that in many instances obtaining a gun is easier than obtaining a driving licence. GJ

Mar 11, 2005, 05:18 AM	#14
radTube just keepin' it cool Join Date: May 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 228 Rep Power: 0	Was this really supposed to be about (american) gun laws? I thought there is/was one thread about them already. But anyway, the article really doesn't prove anything else that humans aren't perfect, and neither are societies, due to consisting of human beings. Hardly worth a thread, this notion. If you wanted to discuss the seemingly weird Japanese mentality, that's another matter. Not that its 'nonwestern' and confusing values are a surprise, if you consider the way the country has in an extremely short time period mixed its traditional samurai-era values with ultramodern, very much hollywood-influenced pop-culture. Not a very compatible match there. Those ancient, strict morals go pretty far in explaining even the high suicide rates. By the way, suicide rates hardly give any indication about the political or cultural advancedness of any given nation, unless you consider countries like Jordan, Iran, or Syria to be great examples of modern, civilised countries (which I doubt many Americans or indeed other westerners do). They just happen to be among the countries with least suicides according to World Health Organization statistics. The other end is populated with ex soviet countries, with Japan and Finland holding the positions 11 and 12 respectively. Last edited by radTube; Mar 11, 2005 at 07:03 AM. Reason: small but confusing typos...

Mar 13, 2005, 08:46 AM	#16
stamvas me-myself & I Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Here Posts: 116 Rep Power: 0	America started with guns. It's in your own hands that you will not continue solving problems with guns (though there are so many signs that something like this is not going to happen). Guns is the culture of US. __________________ P4 @3.2Ghz, 2Gb RAM(@ dual channel), 2 WD HDD/320 Gb, 2*external Maxtor 120Gb, Gigabyte GA8IPE1000-G MoBo, Club-3d Radeon9550-256Mb, 2 Philips 190V7 19" LCD displays, SB0090 w Live Drive, DVD-RAM NEC ND4550A, DVD-RW Lite-onSOHW1633S, M-Audio MIDI keyboard MK225C. Laptop-Fujitsu-Siemens AMILO Pro.

Mar 13, 2005, 07:35 PM	#18
stamvas me-myself & I Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Here Posts: 116 Rep Power: 0	I can't understand why is it so desperately needed to own a gun. Are you so threatened? Who are you afraid of? Maybe the community you have built there? I never felt like owning a gun and I don't feel any threats upon me. Of course where I live at is far away from the American reality. Maybe you Americans have your reasons to feel so. Maybe people are killing and not the guns, but people have manufactured guns in order to kill, so thats what they're made for. Someone who got a gun needs to kill even if he pretends not to. regards __________________ P4 @3.2Ghz, 2Gb RAM(@ dual channel), 2 WD HDD/320 Gb, 2*external Maxtor 120Gb, Gigabyte GA8IPE1000-G MoBo, Club-3d Radeon9550-256Mb, 2 Philips 190V7 19" LCD displays, SB0090 w Live Drive, DVD-RAM NEC ND4550A, DVD-RW Lite-onSOHW1633S, M-Audio MIDI keyboard MK225C. Laptop-Fujitsu-Siemens AMILO Pro.