Man

reno

KMFDM: Stars and Stripes...good song:

A tyrant is a man who allows his people no freedom
who is puffed-up by pride
driven by the lust of power
impelled by greed
provoked by thirst for fame

Divided and conquered
Gripped by fear
Wishful thinking that it can't happen here
It's well underway but nobody knows
A repeat of history
That's how it goes

Tell the people that they're under attack
By man-eating foes from Mars or Iraq
Mobilize outrage
Muzzle dissent
Send in the troops
Strike to pre-empt

Stars and stripes
Learn how to fight
We come together by the dawn of the light
Oh so proudly we hail as the rocket's red glare
Stars and Stripes

Control the airwaves
Fuel the reaction
Use every weapon of mass distraction
Turn active people into passive consumers
Feed 'em bogus polls and harebraned rumors

Cut back civil rights
Make no mistake
Tell 'em homeland security is now at stake
Whip up a frenzy keep 'em suspended
Don't let 'em know that their liberty's ended

Everything goes in the desperate state
The veneer of democracy rapidly fades
Wreak total havoc on all opposition
In any event fulfill your mission

Totalitarian media sensation
You will give 'em domination
Never mind they call you liar and thief
By now you're undisputed commander-in-chief

Markius

i dont get it...does this song say the USA isnt a free country?

The_Neon_Cowboy

"Totalitarian" last time i herd that word mutterd it was by marilin manson....
as forthe takeing freedoms away thats the US congress not the president...

bird chest

uhhh... yeah that is based on what facts. Show me an example of how are freedom is gone?

Falstaff

Read karl Marx
study pluralism and monism
and then tackle the question regarding the philosphy of the duality of man.
we are not all godless nihlists and thieves.
some one has to be in power. and some one must follow
and another thing...
DONT BELIEVE THE HYPE (flavorflav)

reno

Freedom being taken away?

The Patriot Act. Did you know that with this new set of laws and regulations, the government can monitor anything you do WITHOUT a warrant, and then "hold" you for an indeterminate amount of time without possibility for legal counsel? Did you know that now, as a matter of national security, the powers that be are attempting to make access to the Patriot Act restricted to government officials?

Hitler told the German people that Jews, Homosexuals, Gypsies and any non-aryans were ruining their country, attacking the economy, attacking their way of life, attacking their freedom. Hitler made the attack of Poland into a defensive, pre-emptive action. Arabian militants are not the threat, they threaten not only our lives, but the freedom we strive for...and they hate. If we attack now and hunt them down, but suspend some of our "fringe" rights (such as right to privacy, right to free speech) in the process, we can ensure freedom will prevail over the godless horde of murderers in the middle east.

Mass distraction?

Weapons of mass destruction, the threat a broken old man brought to the most powerful nation in the world. Defending freedom. Freedom from what? Freedom from our having to be free? Who needs privacy or free speech, silence any dissent by inflating rumors like impending doom from weapons of mass destruction. Stress the critical necessity of dominating a country for months, a country somehow linked to the terrorist attacks on the WTC. As a matter of fact, eliminate the possibility for a third party investigation to the WTC and pentagon attacks, just to make sure the story is straight. We have to make sure the facts accomodate our vision!



This is the slippery slope, this is where it begins. If something doesn't change, not only will the pledge be mandatory in schools...so will reverence to the leader of the free world. Der Fuhrer des Freistadts! Heil!

Seriously, I can't see how anyone over the age of 20 isn't scared of what is happening, or at least aware of what is happening I guess...

READ THIS TOO

digerati

Ah yes the patriot act. If you mention bomb and a politicians name your phone call can be recorded. But as I recall this evidence can't be used against you, I believe this was brought up in a court trial where they monitored a gangster's phone call without telling him and thus they couldn't use that as evidence, they sided with the gangster. It is legal for them to record your phone call, but not prosecute you on it.

The_Neon_Cowboy

dude they been tapeing 100% ofall phone call since the 1960's... you say the works assisnte,prisident,governer and bomb etc in the same conversation and a recording ofthe entire coveratuion is fowearded to the cia or fbi.


"It is legal for them to record your phone call, but not prosecute you on it."

it was an illegal wire tap ... see law requre that they get a warrnt to legally tap you lines. anty evidence obtained by lawenfocrement though illega mans can not be ised agenst you...

the patroit act lets the get taps with out warrants .... and sibce that change yea any tap/rcored conversation cn be used agesnt you now...

bird chest

the government from what I have heard has not used the patriot act once. Unless you are a terrorist why do you care anyways? Bush is so like hitler I can see where you get the similarities... So shouldn't all middle Easterns all be in ghettos or something since Bush is just like Hitler. Also Hitler blamed the Jews in the country before he got in power. Yeah and I am sure polland had a leader who killled 2 million of his own people to. And hitler rebuilt alll the countries he took over and let them elect their leaders democratically. And hitler always made schools for the people he hated in the countries he took over. And Bush always blames the US problems on middle Easterns.

During any war our rights are taken away a little bit ,if you do not believe me go read about any major war the US was in, these rights have always been given back. The supreme court provided for this with teh clear and present danger clause. And congress had to make the bill so it is not just Bush. So really research stuff before you would make a rediculous claim that bush is like Hitler.

reno

"And Bush always blames the US problems on middle Easterns"

Yeah, SHIT, I totally forgot how Bush blames our terrorism problems on the Brits!

"shouldn't all middle Easterns all be in ghettos or something"

I'm sure Iraq and Iran are BEAUTIFUL to live in...except for the 98% of the country which AREN'T rich off America's oil money.

"Also Hitler blamed the Jews in the country before he got in power"

But it wasn't until he came into power until he really did something about it...to SOLIDIFY his power.

"Yeah and I am sure polland had a leader who killled 2 million of his own people to"

Bush's daddy is responsible for this. After the gulf war Bush Sr. told the iraqis to "rise up" and depose their leader, under the assumption that the US (who had just cleared kuwait of iraqis) would assist a largely unarmed and completely unorganized people. They were wrong. The general for the US forces at the time allowed helicopters to remain in the iraqi arsenal as they came to their kuwaiti "truce." Saddam began by slaughtering the uprising's members with helicopters and death squads...as America stood on the borders and let it happen. America just sat in Kuwait and Israel while all this went on.

BTW, Poland didn't threaten germany militarily, it was economically that they threatened...very similar to if the russians had gotten the billions of dollars worth of oil that Iraq had contracts with them for. Guess who gets those now? Us! Yay democracy!

"And hitler rebuilt alll the countries he took over"

Well, considering he was still under attack throughout the entire campaign...that's kinda like saying Bush should have done this in the middle of the latest campaign...unfeasable.

"During any war our rights are taken away a little bit"

And this is right? Are you fucking nuts? We're the most powerful nation in the world...yet we can't protect our liberties while we protect our freedom? What's the difference? If we're fighting to keep our freedom...why is it slowly being taken away? I fail to see the logic in that. The goal of defeating Iraq is to maintain our freedom right? "freedom will prevail" "haters of freedom" I've heard all these used as reasons...BY BUSH...for his war.

Also, considering we have huge military resources, why can't we police our country without taking freedoms away?

Finally, do you know who has (in a way) the last say about a law? The president. Did he veto it? No, and you do some research mister...the pres can't make laws, but he CAN suggest them to congressmen and can definitely endorse them. Which he the latter of, at LEAST.

No one, except for our one good senator, Feingold (from the best state in the country, wisconsin) even LOOKED at the huge act. A lot were appalled when they did. Feingold voted nay. What does that say about this?



Look, I'm not saying bush is hitler, I'm just saying he's not protecting ours or anyone elses freedoms. And he's certainly doing his business in a pseudo-fascist fashion. Happy, mr. sheeple?

bird chest

The ghettos I was talking about the middle easterns in the US and I know a lot that are not!

Yeah and the economic situation in those countries would be worse then they are now if it weren't for the US's money.

Bush probably does make statements about the middle east but all the statements I have heard have been pertaining to terrorists not the people or countries. Wait I take that back I have heardsome but they are always by some liberal taking the quotes out of context.

As to the rebouilding hitler could have but he chose to go on the offensive. Thier is a difference between that and getting attacked.

As to the rights all I have to say is vietnam. We lost that war because stupid liberals (note I said stupid liberals because there are many intelligent liberals and I have not problem with them) said ya lets go do isolationism again because we learned nothing from wwII and how Hitler got power. Wait same happened in Korea. It is only receantly that we have been the most powerful. We would lose all credibillity as a nation if we pulled out now. Yes we did not help the people in Iraq but where did our orders come from the UN. One of the most useless organizations as of late and it has so much potiential to be good too. We are the most powerful but you act like it is easy to protect people. What if these acts were not passed and bombs did go off in major cities and more planes hit buildings who would you blame? Not the government I hope because you said it could not do its job because it was invading your rights.

"Also, considering we have huge military resources, why can't we police our country without taking freedoms away?" How? all you say is the government should do it then you complain when the do something about it. How should they protect us if they can not do anything to watch the people. We are already running huge defecits and do you know how much money that would cost. All I want you to do is tell me how to police our nation with a military that is not trained to do this task? They are trained to fight!!!!!!!!

The senator thing I love that. It is funny how you look at the Senate and say well every other person except for one who knows more about the situation and the details then me is wrong and then sat they are wrong and I am wright!!!! The supreme court had no problem with the patriot act!!

Obvioulsly bush ratified it but he could not do it on his own so why do you not blame every other member of the senate and call them pseudo facists!!! The truth is is that bush is nowhere close to being a pseudo facist. He is middle right right but not close to being a facist.

reno

The supreme court is also majority republican. And someone who reads something has a stronger opinion, in my honest opinion, than some jackass who just signs on to be "patriotic." Wether Feingold was right or wrong, he was the ONLY senator who even had a clue as to what was in the Patriot Act OTHER than the lies fed to congress by the bill's supporters.

I forgot, America should use it's military to police other nations, whilst they strip away American rights to save money. What was the point of Hitler dominating Europe again? Control, eradication of dissidents?

I am so amazed I missed the blatently obvious truth to our nation's actions. "Let us control you and others, because you can't control yourself.



Think for yourself, jackass.

BluntmaN

1)The patriotism act is a load of bollocks in the first place it is there to police citizens not terrorists.
2)Do you know what makes a terrorist? It is a citizen that has or feels he has nothing to lose. It doesnt require much and no war on terror can stop it. If my country votes a similar anti-terror law me and a couple of friends can become terrorists. Terrorism is born from the feeling that a country or a goverment takes away your freedoms it takes only motivation and some basic knowledge already available on the net.
3)Vietnam was lost because it was fought in a wrong way. The "stupid liberals" who protested Vietnam and Korea are at the heart of democracy and you should thank them.
4)Maybe Bush is not the same as Hitler but the public outcry of "his" wars is proof that he is not exactly a democratic leader either.

And now a question with the American economy in debt and giant problems in your back yard (schools, national insurance, unemployment etc) do you really think that spending a few billions on a war that was not for your protection (as the lack of WMD shows) was a good call?
And let me answer it for you the only reason 100+ US soldiers met their creator was not puting an end to Sadam and freeing the Iraqis (you couldnt care less of the people of Iraq) it was for cheaper oil it was an investment you paid with loads of money and some blood now in that sence what Hitler did to Polland kind off reminds me of what you do to Iraq.

bird chest

You keep saying the patriot is targeting citizens on all those examples of the government pulling in non-terrorists and arresting them. Oh wait that is right they haven't. Don't talk about those guys they pulled right after sept. 11 because that was done before the patriot act I believe, if not call me on it plz.

I am not saying don't be against the war I am saying support the troops. Don't hate the player hate the game and do it peacfully or else it is hypocritical. That is what I was saying on the vietnam war thing.

um unemployment is near what economist call full which is 5% anything more is bad for the economy. So you are holding a few billion over the lives Saddam would take in the future he already killed 2 million of his own people. How many people have to die to make up for the money we spent and lives I say it was worth it but I guess you hold money over lives.

If we do not care about the people in Iraq why would we give them water, schools, food, etc. Why would we not have just struck a deal up with saddam and turned a blind eye to hes actions in return. You base your accusations on no fact please supply some.

You say the protests prove that bush was wrong and yet more people are still in favor of us having gone in lik 45 to 43 percent but still more. An even larger gap believe we should finish the job.

digerati

When we pulled out of Vietnam the North Vietnamese went on a rampage slaughtering people so I doubt we should thank those stupid liberals who let those people get slaughtered. But I do wonder if we hadn't entered the war at all if the revolution would have had less bloodshed. Because I don't really think jumping into that war was a smart decision on our part.

And the majority of the public supported going to war. You have to remember the President doesn't have the power to declare war, only congress does, and since there are a lot of liberals in Congress the only way to get them to go for something they don't like is political stress, and you do that by swaying public opinion. What that means is Bush goes on TV and gives reasons to go to war, and we tend to believe our President. Now it has come out that he made false statements, and don't blame him, blame the CIA. I guarantee you no president would throw away a CIA report, because no president can research this stuff on his/her own. So when the public opinion of people goes towards war then those congressmen want to be re-elected so they're forced to act, now the decision on whether or not to pull out is Bush's I believe.

Falstaff

I personally would like to see a proper balance of republican and democratic interests in governmet,but it isnt going to happen, it is gonna take years to right the wrongs that Clinton did in office.
The reason we went to war is due in large part to Clintons polcies for the entire length of his administration. Bush kicked ass on terrorists and Clinton did not. allowing their power to fester like a huge carbunckle till it became ripe and exploded in a huge geyser of fetid cheese like filth. To hell with Clinton, he is no doubt chasing skirts as we speak and muttering about what he should have done, while Bush embraces the scripture and wreaks vengence on our enemies.