Cheap oil for everybody after the war

Talicni_Tom

one good thing from this war

or it was about iraqi freedom??

this iraqi boy is now free


http://www.dailykos.com/archives/002286.html#002286

JavaFox

If you want to speak at length about civilian causualities, that's fine, but if you, like some of our other members, are only going to post drive-by attacks like this with little interest in true debate, I am going to ask you to refrain from posting.

Zardon

I dont agree with war or violence and it brought me to tears today to see this poor child and his terrible injuries and the loss of his family.

Having just watched Sky news and seeing the joy on thousands of oppressed iraq civilians who have suffered for 30 years under one of the most evil dictators and seeing them crying with the thought of a new life, the thought of a life, a life you and me are accustomed to and perhaps take for granted ---- brings a feeling that perhaps this war wasnt totally in vain.

Having heard some men talking about the way saddam and his people have killed, tortured maimed, and slaughtered their own people while filling their pockets with luxuries and depriving their own people of even a basic way of life, brings a new perspective to my views on this.

Any loss of life is a tragedy and the victims of war and the things I alone have seen make me feel very sad.............. but I feel this country and millions of people will have a better life.

im praying so, just like im praying for that child.

bluelight

Excuse me.....again....This is the second time....When are you moderating...and when are you Javafox the one with personal wiews......?

Well i dont know.


Bluelight

Talicni_Tom

this is just a little remainder for our euphoric warmongers here what the war really is...

iraqis paid high price for their freedom...americans and british decided they have to pay...me thinks iraqis had every right to choose...nobody asked them

The_Neon_Cowboy

Well Mr Pro saddom / anti us protester It doent so who fired the missle....
but as for the iraqy's have have been fireng on and in total dis regard civillians for some time now. Why should they care? they just blame it on us. So most likey this boy lies injured do to an iraqy rpg, or wire guided misles. that artical is super vage and lack many detail be couse it dont want to mention then becouse it then fails to meet it anti US / pro saddom guidlines

you don't compain about a singe atrocity that iraq has comitted before and during this war ... if fact you appear to premote it and support it. So in a way it's your falt since you suport the actions of this terrable regime.

you should have used a better name so people can relize they credablity of your posts immealy like SH4president = (S)addom(h)ussain for president

oh by the way ...
Daily Kos named Best Warblog by Forbes.com The war in Iraq is under way, and after months of debate, bloggers are now going to war. Not all of them like it, although many are cheering.

In choosing the best of the best, we excluded "meta-blogs" like Warblogs.cc and Warblogging, which are essentially compilations of other blogs, many of them opposed to the war .

And his supporting artical for this story

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp.../ts_nm/iraq_dc

I dont see they story or the proof so this becomes a made up story made up out of farytale land to help suport saddom and to apouse the usa.

"Baghdad's hospitals are packed to overflowing with wounded residents of the capital" you forgot to mention that iraqy forcea are knowingly and delibratly fireing apon thier civillians. Espcally ding fire fights to sir them up as to make it hard for us force to fire back. Many being shot down tring to run for safty or to run to U.S / britsh controlled areas for food an water. It has happend many times and is a tatic of the resgime ... so cances are the boy in the pic was injured by iraqy soldgiers.... not the us

you can tell your website is anti us / anto war stance just by browsing thier articals and the reading the REAL story they based it on ... ans that thier only paying much attection to the anti us / anto war articals http://www.dailykos.com/archives/cat_war.html

nuff said

bluelight

Can you explain something to me?

Why is it that you are beginning your post with Well MR pro Saddam??

Is it ok if we that dont agree with you name you Mr Fascist lover? I mean it would be funny wouldnt it?

Bluelight







Bluelight

Falstaff

I know that you wanted to be taken seriously...but you gotta work on your style...or something relevant to a debate about Politics, Economics or Ideology...

I am not going to take your hankerchief from your hands, your feeling pain and your acting out, and your externalizing.

I would really like to see you make a point without pulling out the melodrama switch and pushing it....
You are going to become tiresome with this approach, you got an axe to grind, let's see how clever you are at grinding it, but please turn off the faucet.....

bluelight

'

What?!!

Bluelight

Falstaff

directed at the driveby poster no you, This guy reminds me Geraldo Rivera sometimes, oh god that was low,,sorry about that, no one wants to be called that, ha ha...anyway, Moderators have lots of power and the use it when it is necessary, I am not sticking up for them, have had my problems, but if we are patient with them, and report bad posts they generally take care of the problem,,,they are just human too, (quote).

bluelight

I dont think that the post is irrelevant.
I think it is higly relevant.I mean it is obvious that nobody want children killed..but yet...we sit here discussing the issue blindfolded if we do not accept and see....the4 result of war.

I hear arguments about Saddam having tortured and killed..should we restrict posts about that too because it is unpleasant?

My point as i have mader it all the time...is that if we refuse to look at the consequenses of what we do no matter if our intenet is good or not...then we will never learn for the future.

Most prowar people (except yopu in fact)here refuses to see any misdeads historically at all done by the Usa.It is an impossibility to them.

Why is that...maybe because death is too ugly for them to look at and that accepting it as caused by themselves is so tough that it must be denied.

That my friend...is not a good thing.


This war is not over.

That..will take considerably more tiome than 3 weeks.I hope your government will succed in what they claim they want to achieve...

They have said that now...they will work for an independent Palestine...

Well...how much pressure do you think they will put on Sharon??


None....if you ask me...and thus..the repression will continue against the Palestinians......and thus also

The war.

Bluelight

Falstaff

I was there man, not bragging, that is why I am not pro war, my ships missles killed inoocent people, I have fired an automatic weapon at human beings, never looked to see who I hit or what I hit, it haunts me still..my demon, my problem, my issues.....I hope my government will not repeat the mistakes of the the 80s and 90s, and let the IRAQI people down....

Talicni_Tom

its interesting to see how average braindead american reacts to unpleasent aspects of the war waged by their smart president

one got offended,second denied everything,third thinks its irelevant

axe,grinding ... you mixed up something im not an american

Falstaff

You sure act like one sometimes...and then ;you digress

JavaFox

Talicni, I will not tolerate you calling an entire group of DH members "braindead." Either debate without insult, or don't debate at all.

Falstaff

I did say he reminded me of Geraldo Rivera,,that would really wind anyone up,,,I apologise Talicni_Tom, no one should be called that........can we move on?

BWX

Bluelight, when will you ever learn- In another thread you accuse my government of being to blame because Saddam GASSED his OWN people, right here:

NOW you and your new freind say it is our fault that poor child was hurt because we went to war with Saddam- (even though the extremely unfortunate incident that happened to hurt that child is not proven to be the US's fault, but more likely Saddam's own regime)
YOU cannot have it both ways, you are against the US and the coalition no matter what we do- So all I can do is say this:

Evil abounds when good men do nothing.

And why don't you read this, maybe you will begin to understand why we HAD to do what we are doing now.
This is a little corny at times, but matbe it will help you and people like you why Saddam and all other countries that support terrorism and attack their nieghbors and kill their own peopl eneed to be taken out of power and wiped off the face of the earth.

And to Talicni: Why do you prop up and support people like Saddam? Is he better than US? Why don't you put up all the pictures of the thousands upon thousands of the people he has killed? Or does it only matter to you if the deaths are accidentally caused be Coalition forces trying to hit targets Saddam had embedded among hospitals, shopping centers, childrens daycare centers, and schools? Oh, I guess that kind of behavior is OK it your name is SADDAM????
Maybe you should read this too.

This is a story even the most pro Saddam people can understand. yes it is CORNY, but at least you pro-Saddam/ anti-American people MAY be able to understand the point of this war.




The other day, my nine year old son wanted to
know why we were at war.
My husband looked at our son and then looked at me.
My husband and I were in the Army during
the Gulf War and we would be honored to
serve and defend our country again today.
I knew that my husband would give him a
good explanation.

My husband thought for a few minutes and then told my son to go stand in our front living room window.

He told him:

"Son, stand there and tell me what you see?"

"I see trees and cars and our neighbors houses."
he replied.

"OK, now I want you to pretend that our house and
our yard is theUnited States of America and
you are President Bush."

Our son giggled and said "OK."

"Now son, I want you to look out the window and
pretend that every house and yard on this block
is a different country," my husband said.

"OK Dad, I'm pretending."

"Now I want you to stand there and look out the
window and see that man come out of his house with
his wife and he has her by the hair and is hitting her.
You see her bleeding and crying.
He hits her in the face, he throws her on the ground,
then he starts to kick her to death.
Their children run out and are afraid to stop him,
they are crying, they are watching this but do nothing because they are kids and afraid of their father.
You see all of this son....what do you do?"

"Dad?"

"What do you do son?!"

"I call the police, Dad."

"OK. Pretend that the police are the United Nations
and they take your call, listen to what you know
and saw but they refuse to help.
What do you do then son?"

"Dad, but the police are supposed to help!"
my son starts to whine.

"They don't want to son, because they say that it
is not their placeor your place to get involved and
that you should stay out of it," my husband says.

"But Dad...he killed her!!," my son exclaims.

"I know he did...but the police tell you to stay out of it.
Now I want you to look out that window and
pretend you see our neighbor who you're
pretending is Saddam turn around and do
the same thing to his children."

"Daddy...he kills them?"

"Yes son, he does. What do you do?"

"Well, if the police don't want to help,
I will go and ask my next door neighbor to help
me stop him." our son says.

"Son, our next door neighbor sees what is
happening and refuses to get involved as well.
He refuses to open the door and help you stop him,"
my husband says.

"But Dad, I NEED help!!!
I can't stop him by myself!!"

"WHAT DO YOU DO SON?"

Our son starts to cry.

"OK, no one wants to help you, the man across
the street saw you ask for help and saw that no
one would help you stop him.
He stands taller and puffs out his chest.
Guess what he does next son?"

"What Daddy?"

"He walks across the street to the old ladies
house and breaks down her door and drags
her out, steals all her stuff and sets her house
on fire and then...he kills her.
He turns around and sees you standing in
the window and laughs at you.
WHAT DO YOU DO?!!!"

"Daddy..."

"WHAT DO YOU DO?!!!"

Our son is crying and he looks down and he whispers,
"I close the blinds, Daddy."

My husband looks at our son with tears in his
eyes and asks him ... "Why?"

"Because Daddy.....the police are supposed to help...people who needs it....and they won't help....
You always say that neighbors are supposed to
HELP neighbors, but they won't help either...
they won't help me stop him...I'm afraid....
I can't do it by myself...Daddy.....I can't look out
my window and just watch him do all these
terrible things and...and.....do nothing...so....
I'm just going to close the blinds....
so I can't see what he's doing........
and I'm going to pretend that it is not happening."

I start to cry.

My husband looks at our nine year old son
standing in the window, looking pitiful and
ashamed at his answers to my husbands questions
and he tells him...."Son"

"Yes, Daddy."

"Open the blinds because that man....
he's at your front door...
"WHAT DO YOU DO?!!!!"

My son looks at his father, anger and defiance
in his eyes. He balls up this tiny fists and looks
his father square in the eyes, without hesitation he says:
"I DEFEND MY FAMILY DAD!!
I'M NOT GONNA LET HIM HURT MOMMY
OR MY SISTER, DAD!!!
I'M GONNA FIGHT HIM, DAD,
I'M GONNA FIGHT HIM!!!!!"

I see a tear roll down my husband's cheek and he
grabs my son to his chest and hugs him tight, and cries...
"It's too late to fight him, he's too strong and
he's already at YOUR front door son.....
you should have stopped him
BEFORE he killed his wife.
You have to do what's right, even if you have to do it alone, before......it's too late." my husband whispers.

THAT scenario I just gave you is
WHY we are at war with Iraq.
When good men stand by and let evil happen
is the greatest EVIL of all.
OurPresident is doing what is right.
We, as a free nation, must understand
that this war is a war of humanity.
WE must remove this evil man from power
so that we can continue to live in a free world
where we are not afraid to look out our window
and see crimes on humanity.
So that my nine year old son won't grow up in
a world where he feels that if he just "closes" the
blinds the atrocities in the world won't affect him.

Today the second day of "WAR on IRAQ" I felt compelled to write this and pass it along.
Hopefully, you will understand the lesson my
husband tried to teach our son.

"YOU MUST NEVER BE AFRAID TO
DO WHAT IS RIGHT!
EVEN IF YOU HAVE TO DO IT ALONE!"

BE PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN!
BE PROUD OF OUR PRESIDENT!
BE PROUD OF OUR TROOPS!!
SUPPORT THEM!!!
SUPPORT AMERICA!!
SO THAT IN THE FUTURE OUR CHILDREN WILL NEVER HAVE TO CLOSE THEIR
BLINDS...."

Falstaff

embraces no one faith, race, ideology, or country.....Evil is well, in an of itself...something that one could easily find within the bunting and patriotic patina of nationalism....be careful man....I keep my flag in my heart....not on my car fender, If you want to push the emotional driven good vs. evil dynamic and applyi it to this conflict, there are more complex arguments than a comparison to violence at home, in the home or within the hearts of wounded children.....Let me put this into perspective, and I am not asking you to feel sorry for Hussein,
but is well know he was abused and beaten before you and I started school, he had to steal and lie and cheat for a criminal step father when he was a teenager, and learned to inflict the pain he felt from within the shattered psyche of a wounded child.
He learned to express his hatred and pain and learned much when he was high school age from his Grandfather, a man that published a politically and racially inflammatory book. He was beaten as a child with an asphalt covered pipe if he didn't do as he was told....From a childhood of violence, he learned violence, learned to torture and maim, and constructed his terrible vision of his future from the failed coup attempt he was nearlyi killed in the process of performing, yes he was an assasin..weep for the children of IRAQ that must be faced with violence every single day, be thankful your an american...but can you see that your analogy may be flawed if you wrap it within the american flag...I respect the thrust of your idea...but it is too emotionally charged...because I will then show you the terrible hell tha Saddam Hussein grew up in....and the subsequent terrible path towards domination and power of a people he despised....his own....Now that is a tragedy...

bluelight

Well you are not gonna make me read a full page of monitor text that ends like this:








"YOU MUST NEVER BE AFRAID TO
DO WHAT IS RIGHT!
EVEN IF YOU HAVE TO DO IT ALONE!"

BE PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN!
BE PROUD OF OUR PRESIDENT!
BE PROUD OF OUR TROOPS!!
SUPPORT THEM!!!
SUPPORT AMERICA!!
SO THAT IN THE FUTURE OUR CHILDREN WILL NEVER HAVE TO CLOSE THEIR

BLINDS...."




.....my patience with reading on monoitors does not go that ......................far



Bluelight

Falstaff

I wonder if he really believes it? There is some validity even within the context of