Memory Question

cozumel

I still haven't ordered the 2x2GB Gskill PC2-8000 sticks for my new rig as I'm still waiting on GT back-order to arrive.

So I would like to get the maximum possible performance from my rig for gaming and to overclock. So the 1x2GB Ballistix PC2-8500 have just gone down in price by about 19% (for one week only) and has left me thinking. I would prefer to have 4GB total but would also don't want to use all for slots as it 'works' the memory controller a bit and slows things down.

So the choice is GSkill PC2-8000 F2-8000CL5D-4GBPQ 2x2GB or Crucial Ballistix PC2-8500 1x2GB (2 kits = 4GB)
4GB of Ballistix is only about £25 more than the GSkill kit for the next six days.

So here is the question then:
The GSkill uses Powerchip ICs as far as I'm aware while the Ballistix uses Microns. The overclock available to the Crucial sticks will be restrivted as I will have utilised all the available slots on the m/board. The overclock available to the GSkill is likely to be very small (say 20-50MHz). Is it better to have only used two slots or to have all the slots full and memory clocked at higher speeds to get the best Vista / gaming performance? I know what I reckon you will say but need some feedback from someone who has maybe tried both setups (or similar).


New rig under contruction:
GA-P35-DS4
EVGA 8800GT 512MB (which I'll 'step-up' to the GTS/GTX when the G92 versions are available)
Q6600 G0
Auzentech X-Fi Prelude
2 x Barracudas 7200.10
Vista x64

kris23

i know Judas knows how to run 8 gigs like nada man so he should have the info you need

but another thing id like to show is Geil's Esoteria series.

Newegg.com - Computer Parts, PC Components, Laptop Computers, Digital Cameras and more!

also, the thing about running memory on all 4 slots is the stress that is put on the northbridge, the thing will get pretty damn hot basically...... so cooling on there is nneded. the DS4 seems to have that covered though, just buy some thermal paste (MX-2 or tuniq TX-2)

im also wondering if you are interested in this.
Newegg.com - Foxconn X38A LGA 775 Intel X38 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail

saw a bit of reviews on it and its good, DDR3 prices are dropping FAST so it would be a good idea since once DDR2 and DDR3 reach equivalent price points, you can get DDR3 if you need more RAM.

reviews saw it as a decent, stable board, on par with the X38 P5E3 Deluxe

cozumel

Thanks Kris. The only 2x2 above PC2-6400 I can find in the UK are the GSKILL!!

Then I was checking prices today and a etailer have dropped the price of Ballistix for one week hence the question. I've emailed Gigabyte a few hours ago to see whether their are any know issues filling all the slots.

As far as the Foxconn is concerned I've already paid for the DS4. Done and dusted. The only bits I need now is the DDR2, Q6600 G0 and Auzentech. I was gonna hold off buying all three parts 'till the GT arrives (still on back-order) but with the Ballistix deal I am thinking again about the choices.

kris23

im pretty sure there are no issues with 4 gigs of ballistix on the board, i am very certain that you will get more performance off them than the G.Skill sticks.

as there tends to be issues with somr software and drivers and 8 gigs of RAM, i say go for the Ballsitix, don't think you need anything else.

cozumel

Cool.

AndyOCZ also just replied to me when I put the same question on another forum:

kris23

sounds about right, but ANY memory will get damaged if memory is unusually high.

thats why everyone gets memory fans.

ChaosMinionX

Some info on Micron IC's

They respond very well to voltages, and are some of the best overclocking sticks out there.

Most companies today (OCZ, Corsair,etc) bin the micron IC's they get very aggressively, and generally the flag ship models are running 2.4v on them with active cooling.... while their failure rate in terms of the amount of RAM sold is low, its quite high from a consumer point of view.

Generally if you get high end RAM - IE... FLEXLC, Dominator, Reaper stuff... it will be rated for 2.4v at the higher bins and generally those sticks will sometimes die for whatever reason usually from the voltage is the general finding, or the board over volting or any number of things to include just ineherent failure of the IC's as a whole.

So to keep them longer generally you can keep the same warrantied clocks at a much lower voltage, the amount of ram they do they cant individually test each set to find the lowest possible voltage to make them run stable, and at the guaranteed specs by the company so they bin them by electrical characteristics and say the ones with the same qualities get 2.0/2.1/2.2/2.3/2.4v right across the board for that whole line of RAM. Its only usually set at those voltages to guarantee that for latencies of say 3-3-3-9 or 4-4-4-12 or 5-5-5-15 that it will take any of the said voltages before to attain those specs on any sticks of that same model number.

So that being said an example of this-

Corsair Dominator 6400C3DF is warrantied/guaranteed to run 3-4-3-9 DDR2 800mhz @ 2.4v with the dominator airflow fan, however in actuality it will do 3-4-3-9 DDR2 800 @ 2.15/2.2v so it would extend the life of your RAM quite a bit in that case, also in other cases reducing the voltage and then experimenting with timings of RAM (especially micron) you will find that stuff rated for 3-4-3-9 will do 3-3-3-6 DDR2 800 @ 2.2v as well, or 4-4-4-12 will do 4-4-4-8/10 @ 2.2v or anything of that nature.

Hope thats informative

EDIT: Oh and because of the density of the IC's 2x2GB kits they tend not to overclock as well, or respond as well to voltage increases. So if your buying them for overclocking a system just keep that in mind.

kris23

clearer than anyway i can explain it, good job!

cozumel

I'll order the Ballistix tomorrow. And the Q6600 which has also been reduced for six days by the same etailer. I'm on a winwin situation atm.

I received an email saying the 8800GT should be with me next week so hopefully I'll have her up and running sometime during next week.

kris23

yay good luck man! lol

PangingJr

if i were to buy a 2x1GB DDR2 memory kit and it's for my overclocking needs, then i want to be sure that i buy the memory kit that uses Micron D9- GCT/GMH/GKX IC on the modules, this due to the DDR2 that uses the Micron D9's is known to be a good overclocker memory.

but now if i want to buy DDR2 again it would be 2x2GB memory kit, one reason being that i have never tried one yet, and i want even more so to see if i will be able to run a certain memory multi/ratio that i cannot run it with 2 sets of 2x1GB memory kit.

as of now, i for myself use Gigabyte P965 and P35 and my friend who uses a P35-DS3R/DS4/DQ6, Q6600/E6850/E6750 and we are now using these memory kits...
G.SKill PC2 6400 (DDR2-800) HZ 2x1GB kits, G.Skill PC2 8500 (DDR2-1066) HK 2x1GB kits, Kingston HyperX PC2 9200 (DDR2-1150) 2x1GB kits, HyperX PC2 9600 (DDR2-1200) 2x1GB kits, 2 sets of all the kits, and we both still want to try 2x2GB memory kit like the G.Skill DDR2 1000 PQ 2x2GB kit, and some of mushkin 2x2GB memory kit ourself.
i can't speak for you on this, but i sure can speak for myself. anyways, you will know soon enough whether you like it or not when you get your system up and running

cozumel

That are the ICs in the Ballistix. The GSkill have Powerchip ICs and have typically been overclocking at between 1020-1100MHz whoch means that on average I may not even get to the stock 1066MHz of the Ballistix. And I want to be overclocking man.....



That is something I too have thought about but I won't really know exactly what will happen until I have everything up and running. I would prefer to have a 1:1 ratio if at all possible.



God, how I would love to be able to afford the Mushkin - It's way out of my league lol


I have emailed Gigabyte and expect to have an answer in the morning about the 4 slot situation. If they are saying they have no notification of any problems running the Ballistix in all the slots then I have to go for the Ballistix. Now, if there had been an HZ GSkill 2x2GB PC2-8000 in the stores I most definitely would have gone for that. The Reaper was also outside my max budget.

PangingJr

i used to ask Lowfat once about using 4:5 at CPU FSB 450MHz and above, and i just recall that he uses P35-DQ6 and some Ballistix memory kits before, you can check with him if you need some more info, for example, the MCH voltage and the memory voltage itself.
as of now, myself and my friend, who both likes very much to be able to run 4:5 on our Gigabyte P965 and P35,
i can ran 4x1GB and at CPU FSB 400MHz and 4:5 DDR2 1000MHz and with a lot of volts and still hardly get a stable Windows.
i can still run 4x1GB, CPU FSB 444MHz, 5:6, DDR2 1066MHz and again with a lot of volts and never get a stable system.
all of our Micron D9 based memory kits are doing so well when they are at 2x1GB, but not when they are 4x1GB under our Gigabyte's.
what we have experienced with our is that, if there is too much MCH voltage in our Gigabyte's P35, it's just won't work, lol.
anyways, it's all up to you, and depending on how you like your overclocking to be, i guess.

cozumel

Right Panging. The Corsair Support Forums are also saying the same thing for the DS4. The Support Tech has advised people to get the 2x2GB instead of 4x1GB saying that users would have to drop the speed otherwise. And from what I you are saying I would not be able to up the DDR2 voltage to offset this.

I am kinda concerned but do have a fall-back plan. Again I will wait for feedback from Gigabyte tomorrow (today). I will also PM Lowfat. If they say ok or are unsure I will go ahead with Ballistix. In the UK, under distance selling regulations, I can return the goods within 7 days of delivery for a full refund. So at the very least I could try the Ballistix and if no good then return the sticks and get the GSkill instead.

PangingJr

i think you will only need to be at CPU FSB 400MHz...
either 400x9 3.6GHz of CPU speed, which is quite very good already for Q6600 or just 400x8 3.2GHz or so.
now, when you run the overclocking, if possible, try all these memory multi, 2.0x (1:1 DDR2 @ 800MHz), 2.4x (5:6 DDR2 @ 960MHz) and if possible 2.5x (4:5 DDR2 @ 1000MHz), try them all, and you will see what you like best. you probably won't want to try CPU FSB 500, maybe 450 at the most. anyway, so like i was saying before, it does not mean you won't be able to overclock your system or anything like that, it's just depending on how far you plan to overclock the system, and since you will be using a Q6600, i think you won't or can't do a very high FSB overclocking attemps anyway. and it's possible that the memory you have choose to use will suit your needs well already.