Poor Radeon 9600 Pro performance, esp. FSAA

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 16, 2003, 04:59 PM

Once again it's ATI's turn for a new series of "downgraded" cards where the higher number suggests a better performance, but just the opposite is the case. They already did this with the Radeon 9000 (a lot slower than 8500), 9100 (faster than 9000, but slower than 8500 because slower core and much slower memory), and 9200 (which is only 9000 with 8xAGP)

Now it's time for another rip-off when they bring out the 9600 cards, which are generally slower than their 9500 pendants (see review at Beyond3D from front page news). The difference between 9500 and 9600 isn't often that big, but the difference between 9500 Pro and 9600 Pro is much more appaling

Especially the Shaders are quite a bit slower in higher resolutions (most of all the new 2.0 shaders), and they did another trick. One of the strong points of the ATI 9500 cards is their good FSAA performance, so they said, "Can't be! Let's do something about it!" So they degraded FSAA performance a good bit, which is most notable in high resolutions (6xFSAA as example here):

Geez... just how braindead can you be?

There they have a good advantage over nVidia with their FSAA, and what do they do? They cut it down, effectively voiding their advantage!

Until now, you could say, "Ok, the 9500 Pro has less raw power than the 4800SE, but it makes up for that with its good FSAA performance." Well, no more now, as the new 9600 Pro now is behind not only in raw power, but also in FSAA power

Whichever morons at ATI came up with that 9600 crap, they managed to shoot themselves in the foot pretty nicely. As I see it, if nVidia regains the performance crown, it will not because of them producing superior cards, but because ATI does some idiotic crap like this, which lets the nVidia cards look good in comparison!

***Zardon*** · Apr 16, 2003, 05:02 PM

hey at least you can add

It's really fast - heck, it can even whip a Radeon 9600 Pro

in your sig now?

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 16, 2003, 05:47 PM

Originally posted by Zardon
hey at least you can add

It's really fast - heck, it can even whip a Radeon 9600 Pro

in your sig now?

Sure, why not?

I'll do it right away

LukeK · Apr 17, 2003, 07:34 PM

LOL asuka I think you better check out these benchmarks http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDY0LDI= the 9600 pro overclocks like hell and OWNS your 4800 !!!!

Quote:

Needless to say, we were shocked by the incredible overclocking ability of this graphics card. With a stable core frequency of 567MHz, we were operating the card no less than 167MHz above the default frequency! With a simple movement of the slider within the drivers, the card was suddenly given an almost 50% increase in core frequency. Given the card's already high frequency, this is certainly an impressive accomplishment.

In terms of memory frequencies, it seemed as though the card had ample room to improve here as well. By default, the memory on the Radeon 9600 Pro was running at an effective frequency of 600MHz. As we saw in the review, the memory modules seen on this card are rated for 700MHz. Therefore, we were not surprised to see the card easily reach 700MHz and continue onwards. In fact, the memory modules ran completely stable up to a final frequency of 716MHz! With these memory frequencies combined with the insane core frequency, we were sure to see some dramatic improvements in the benchmark results.

Quote:

Looking at this graph, we see the overclocked 9600 Pro has managed to equal the 9700 Pro's performance at each resolution. Apparently, ATI has done an excellent polishing job on their latest generation of cards and have prepared them to perform extremely well on the newer breed of games.

Quote:

Once more, we find the Radeon 9600 Pro rivaling the 9700 Pro. Considering the fact that most 9700 Pro's are still selling for $299, the fact that the 9600 Pro is even competitive ( albeit overclocked ) certainly speaks volumes about the card's overall value.

Quote:

We have just seen that in some cases, an overclocked 9600 Pro can even challenge a 9700 Pro with positive results. Those who are looking forward to next generation games will do well to take notice of this card's scores in Splinter Cell. Should this title be any indication of the next crop of games ( which it likely is ), the Radeon 9600 Pro will be the highest performing solution available in this price range. Equipped with the speed, image quality, and excellent overclocking ability, the Radeon 9600 Pro has proven to be an exceptional graphics card.

time to change that sig before you look a little silly, eh?

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 17, 2003, 07:56 PM

Originally posted by LukeK
LOL asuka I think you better check out these benchmarks http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDY0LDI= the 9600 pro overclocks like hell and OWNS your 4800 !!!!

So what?

The OC of the 9600 is pitiful compared to what I can do with my 4800. It has stock 550 and can OC up to wicked 720!!!

The 9600 can only OC from 600 stock to 716, which is nowhere near as much

So, who owns who now?

time to change that sig before you look a little silly, eh?

Nope, no need for it. The only one that is making a total ass out of himself is you.

Vampyromaniac · Apr 17, 2003, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Asuka
Once again it's ATI's turn for a new series of "downgraded" cards where the higher number suggests a better performance, but just the opposite is the case. They already did this with the Radeon 9000 (a lot slower than 8500), 9100 (faster than 9000, but slower than 8500 because slower core and much slower memory), and 9200 (which is only 9000 with 8xAGP)

I agree . . . I dunno what is going on with some of their naming schemes

Quote:

Geez... just how braindead can you be? There they have a good advantage over nVidia with their FSAA, and what do they do? They cut it down, effectively voiding their advantage!
Until now, you could say, "Ok, the 9500 Pro has less raw power than the 4800SE, but it makes up for that with its good FSAA performance." Well, no more now, as the new 9600 Pro now is behind not only in raw power, but also in FSAA power

Here are some UT2003 framerates, which include nVidia cards in the comparison:

(from AnandTech)

LukeK · Apr 18, 2003, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Asuka
[B]So what?

The OC of the 9600 is pitiful compared to what I can do with my 4800. It has stock 550 and can OC up to wicked 720!!!
The 9600 can only OC from 600 stock to 716, which is nowhere near as much So, who owns who now?

wow less than 10mhz on the ram??? Can your core hit over 500??? I think not man, your card is NOTHING compared to the 9600 pro, nevermind the core speeds, and overall performance what about with FSAA and aniso? the 4xxx series of cards CHOKES with that on, and no one in their right mind buys a NON DX9 card nowadays. Anyone with sense buys a card that can handle FSAA nad aniso, if they can afford it. I understand alot of people cant, but you are such a bigoted Nvidia fan boy its hard to believe. Every post you are slagging off ATI with nonsense rubbish posts and insulting anyone who doesnt agree. and yet you seem quite ill educated on the subjects. I mean look at your sig, what a load of nonsense. If you are quoting statistics, like you just did, dont quote a less than 10mhz Ram difference, quote a 200mhz+ core difference and start quoting FSAA figures.

IMO you bought a turkey and you know it, therefore you are going around the whole board saying ATI and their cards suck because you know you bought something that is being outperformed by most other modern cards.

The 9600 pro is going to be an overclockers delight ! you cant start quoting stock figures anymore......

Quote:

Nope, no need for it. The only one that is making a total ass out of himself is you.

I think your attitude on the board and the way you speak to people just shows how arrogant, self conceited and big headed you are. but at least your sig makes people laugh

toddsmack2k · Apr 18, 2003, 09:30 AM

First and foremost DH is a friendly place. Second this is the Technology Section and insulting or being rude will not be tolerated! Those types of remarks and attitudes will be kept in the flame warzone please! If you want to bicker and insult each other then go to the flame warzone.

Apr 16, 2003, 04:59 PM	#1
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Poor Radeon 9600 Pro performance, esp. FSAA Once again it's ATI's turn for a new series of "downgraded" cards where the higher number suggests a better performance, but just the opposite is the case. They already did this with the Radeon 9000 (a lot slower than 8500), 9100 (faster than 9000, but slower than 8500 because slower core and much slower memory), and 9200 (which is only 9000 with 8xAGP) Now it's time for another rip-off when they bring out the 9600 cards, which are generally slower than their 9500 pendants (see review at Beyond3D from front page news). The difference between 9500 and 9600 isn't often that big, but the difference between 9500 Pro and 9600 Pro is much more appaling Especially the Shaders are quite a bit slower in higher resolutions (most of all the new 2.0 shaders), and they did another trick. One of the strong points of the ATI 9500 cards is their good FSAA performance, so they said, "Can't be! Let's do something about it!" So they degraded FSAA performance a good bit, which is most notable in high resolutions (6xFSAA as example here): Geez... just how braindead can you be? There they have a good advantage over nVidia with their FSAA, and what do they do? They cut it down, effectively voiding their advantage! Until now, you could say, "Ok, the 9500 Pro has less raw power than the 4800SE, but it makes up for that with its good FSAA performance." Well, no more now, as the new 9600 Pro now is behind not only in raw power, but also in FSAA power Whichever morons at ATI came up with that 9600 crap, they managed to shoot themselves in the foot pretty nicely. As I see it, if nVidia regains the performance crown, it will not because of them producing superior cards, but because ATI does some idiotic crap like this, which lets the nVidia cards look good in comparison!

Apr 18, 2003, 09:30 AM	#8
toddsmack2k It Never..... Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Kentucky Posts: 3,174 Rep Power: 0	Excuse me but.... First and foremost DH is a friendly place. Second this is the Technology Section and insulting or being rude will not be tolerated! Those types of remarks and attitudes will be kept in the flame warzone please! If you want to bicker and insult each other then go to the flame warzone. __________________ [color=blue]*Bleeding From the Inside Pouring Out, The* *DriverHeaven* Spiral, We Shall Never Let Go Of.[/color]

Apr 16, 2003, 05:02 PM	#2
*Zardon* enchanted Join Date: May 2002 Location: Driverheaven Posts: 32,252 Rep Power: 3150	hey at least you can add It's really fast - heck, it can even whip a Radeon 9600 Pro in your sig now?

Apr 16, 2003, 05:47 PM	#3
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Originally posted by Zardon hey at least you can add It's really fast - heck, it can even whip a Radeon 9600 Pro in your sig now? Sure, why not? I'll do it right away

Apr 17, 2003, 07:56 PM	#5
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Originally posted by LukeK LOL asuka I think you better check out these benchmarks http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDY0LDI= the 9600 pro overclocks like hell and OWNS your 4800 !!!! So what? The OC of the 9600 is pitiful compared to what I can do with my 4800. It has stock 550 and can OC up to wicked 720!!! The 9600 can only OC from 600 stock to 716, which is nowhere near as much So, who owns who now? time to change that sig before you look a little silly, eh? Nope, no need for it. The only one that is making a total ass out of himself is you.