The Dig got a new rig, but only for a week and I'm a bit confused.

digitalwanderer · Mar 1, 2003, 11:18 AM

Ok, first off some stats:

XP2200+
1 x 256mb PC2100 Generic DDR
KX7-333R motherboard with all orignal parts and disc's
SK-6 CPU solid copper kooler and 1 case fan installed
generic mid tower case with 400watt PSU with 2 front USB ports
48x12x48 lite-on burner
16x Sony DVD drive
GF4ti4200 64mb DDR 3.5ns Leadtek all cables and stuff
80gig maxtor ata133 7200 RPM drive 2mb cache
10/100 nic card
sound blaster live 5.1 sound card
new keyboard and mouse

Mmmmmmmm....a nice start, eh? It gets better. The thing came clean as a whistle and solid, and it ain't half-way bad looking. (It's a sharp looking case rather than a tacky-cheap looking one, I approve) It came with win2K nicely installed, but I wiped the drive for luck and am half-way thru setting up a dual 98se/XP boot on it. I got the 98se installed & tweaked in, and had to take a break to start loading it up and playing with it.

It plays well, VERY well.

I haven't done any hardware modifications yet, but I did clock the card from about 250/520 to 300/600 and it seems to like it just fine. (Yes, I just picked some round numbers and they worked...I was in a hurry.

) I don't THINK I have the CPU overclocked right now...I played around with it just a bit but decided not to worry about it yet, it don't seem to be needing for horsepower in that department yet.

So here's the things I DON'T get:

SoF & GTA3 run great, better than Bubbles can do it...which I kind of expected. Bubbles gets about 7K onions and Vladd (yes, I've already named the new rig "Vladd"

) gets 10K without breaking a sweat right now.

What surprised me was Mafia and Unreal2....those are bugging me.

Unreal2 is dogging, I mean DOGGING it in firefights. The FPS dips into the mid-teens and I just don't find that acceptable....Bubbles plays a MUCH better game of U2 than Vladd which doesn't make sense to me!

Mafia is sort of the opposite, Vladd is playing it so well it's scary! I'm not sure on FPS since I haven't bothered with fraps yet, (did I mention I'm only half-way thru building this thing and just on a "screw-around-with-it-for-a-bit break right now?

), but it was really smooth. So I enabled 4xAA 4xAF and it's STILL really smooth.

Hey, with those settings it was still jerky on Bubbles with the 9500 Pro in her.

So it's stronger in some areas and weaker in a few others. I want to say the U2 problem is just the 256Mb of RAM in this thing...but methought 256MB was enough for most stuff in 98se, and it's been a while since I've been on anything with less than 512Mb. (It's the one area me friend is skimping in a little bit for right now to save $, but it's still a pretty good deal for $525us shipped.

)

I might just tell him not to play U2 'til he gets another ram stick, but I don't know...

kinetic · Mar 1, 2003, 11:49 AM

I wouldn't expect a huge drop in framerate on UT 2 with that set up Dig although, as you say, another stick of ram wouldn't do any harm. What drivers are you using for the GF4?

digitalwanderer · Mar 1, 2003, 11:52 AM

43.00 9x

Madgoat1979 · Mar 1, 2003, 12:13 PM

If you enable v-sync your fps should leval out...

I found with 256 ... (And my ti 4200) that if I kept it enabled most games would play ok, (without CRAZY drops in FPS)

BUT, if you have v-sync DISABLED.... then your comp is cacheing a lot more.... so your ram is filling up.

(I had to play with that ALOT before I got my other stick of 256...)

Peace

MG

***Zardon*** · Mar 1, 2003, 01:58 PM

unreal 2 also caches in system memory.

Malus · Mar 1, 2003, 02:30 PM

Windows 98 has horrible memory management. . .

ToshiroOC · Mar 1, 2003, 02:50 PM

Digi! The bluebirdything! NOOOOOO!

Sounds like a great computer, though perhaps the UT2 thing is because of a driver glitch? Have you tried other drivers on the rig to see if that would help the UT2 framerate?

BWX · Mar 1, 2003, 04:27 PM

I have tried ALL drivers with my 4200 and 256 mb of ram, and I have seen some weird slowdowns in some games (only single player though?) But when I go back to the 41.09's most of those weird slowdown glitches go away. I'm using the 42.82's now, and they play SOF2 multiplayer better than any other driver on my system, but single player RTCW has some weird glitches, slowdown in spots w/ them. Of course this is all on an XP pro machine- but for the hell of it you might want to try the 41.09's and just see if they work any better for the problem areas. This is on a 64mb ti4200 @300/600 also.

No_Style · Mar 1, 2003, 05:55 PM

Nice Avatar

Digital

-={420}=- · Mar 2, 2003, 12:10 AM

The question burning in my mind right now is...WHY WINDOWS 98? Windows 98 is nothing but a browser stapled onto a graphical OS duct-taped onto an ancient character-based DOS with roots in the '70s. Hehe

EDIT:

BWX · Mar 2, 2003, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by -={420}=-
The question burning in my mind right now is...WHY WINDOWS 98? Windows 98 is nothing but a browser stapled onto a graphical OS duct-taped onto an ancient character-based DOS with roots in the '70s. Hehe

Look at my 3dmark score at the bottom- It is with win98se. I can't get within 500 points of that most of the time- and I've disabled all the services and done a bunch of other tweeks to my system to try. I even o/c'ed it way faster until it wouldn't even run the test and locked up and O/C'ed mt video card way higher than I should have. I also tried every other driver I could get my hands on and I think the highest I ever got was 11,200 or something, and that was on a really cold day. With all the planets lined up just right.

I could get almost 11,500 all day everyday with win98 and my games all ran smoother too. I got XP pro working pretty good, but not like 98se for games. win98se has it's high points. Along with some bad ones of course.

digitalwanderer · Mar 2, 2003, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BWX232
Look at my 3dmark score at the bottom- It is with win98se. I can't get within 500 points of that most of the time- and I've disabled all the services and done a bunch of other tweeks to my system to try. I even o/c'ed it way faster until it wouldn't even run the test and locked up and O/C'ed mt video card way higher than I should have. I also tried every other driver I could get my hands on and I think the highest I ever got was 11,200 or something, and that was on a really cold day. With all the planets lined up just right.

I could get almost 11,500 all day everyday with win98 and my games all ran smoother too. I got XP pro working pretty good, but not like 98se for games. win98se has it's high points. Along with some bad ones of course.

TELL THE MAN, TELL HIM!!!

98se is just better on my rigs for some things...pure & simple it IS! I have XP and am gradually working myself into it, and when I do some massive 5-8 day downloads I always do it from me XP install since it IS more stable...but if I want to have the best gaming experience I can have I use 98se 'cause it works best for me.

-={420}=- · Mar 2, 2003, 02:40 PM

I don't know. I couldn't go back to win98. There are just so many things wrong with it. I do agree that it runs SOME games smoother but most of the new games out there are optimized for windows xp. And there's just so many more things you can do, so many more options/features in winxp that win98 just cant compete with. Windows XP isn't the best...in some cases I would even say I hate it...I hope Microsoft releases a better OS (longhorn) so it's more stable and faster. I sure hope longhorn won't be a more bloated winxp. I even noticed your signature says "uhh- I'm starting to like this OS better than Win98 in some ways" Yep! Well, let's hope M$ doesn't mess up.

BWX · Mar 3, 2003, 12:51 AM

Yup 420, it does take a while to get used to XP, but over all I think I like it better. I think I'll like it even more w/ another 256 or even 512mb of ram. 256mb was great for win98se, but to me it's bare minimum for XP. The only thing is, I don't want to go get more pc2100 when I know that I'm going to want some nice corsair (or any other good name brand) low latency pc3200 in the future. So until I upgrade my motherboard, there is no sense in getting more ram.

You can't mix memory like that can you? You have to use the same speed memory in all the slots don't you? If not I may pick up a stick of the new faster stuff. But I have to find out if it works in my motherboard first. I should start a thread about memory compatibilities, because I don't know nearly enough about it.

merry · Mar 3, 2003, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BWX232
You can't mix memory like that can you? You have to use the same speed memory in all the slots don't you?

Well, actually I think you can, but it will all run at the fastest speed the slowest stick is capable of, that is 2100+3200=2x2100... doesn't seem to make much sense.

BWX · Mar 3, 2003, 07:00 AM

Yeah, exactly, so in my situation I might well just take the old ram out completely- BUT- can pc3200 ram run as slow as 266 mhz?? Can I put that kinda ram in a motherboard only capable of running it at 280 or so mhz OC'd? I guess it should work, I just didn't know how SLOW you could run really fast pc3200 or faster memory--
hmmm

-={420}=- · Mar 3, 2003, 08:42 PM

So can u put pc3200 or pc3500 memory in any motherboard that has DDR or only some?

merry · Mar 4, 2003, 04:25 AM

I don't have any direct experience with DDR (sigh), but it should work - in this respect - much like SDR. I used PC133 in my first rig, on a Celeron@66MHz FSB, so the memory ran at half it's rated speed (and still does after a number of years).

Now if I'm not mistaken, 3200 runs@166MHz (the "physical" clock), which should do OK @133MHz (=266/2). I can't be 100% sure not trying it myself, but I'd give it 99% chances to work.

EDIT: Oops, 3200 runs @200MHz... still should work...

BWX · Mar 4, 2003, 06:15 PM

That makes sense to me. Plus w/ the prices of memory right now, this is a very good time to buy some!

digitalwanderer · Mar 4, 2003, 06:22 PM

What's the cheapest/best I could get for me friends? It's killing me that it's only 256, it deserves the extra 256 to take it to 512. (I'm falling in love with this rig, damn it!

)

~~JAV~~ · Mar 4, 2003, 07:42 PM

Quote:

cheapest/best

Hmmm, gonna go out on a limb here > Go to Newegg & look @ SimpleTech 512mb stick of PC-2700 for $58 & $5 shipping. The good: 166/333, CL2.5 & a lifetime guarantee. The bad: I've never used SimpleTech & the name ???. Newegg has the rep if there is a problem tho'.

I honestly wouldn't get PC-2100 to match what is there, that board & CPU *need* 166/333 capable ram to shine.

Tell me how high you've gotten the FSB on that 2100 & I may make an offer to offset the cost.

Quote:

(I'm falling in love with this rig, damn it! )

Hang in there > your time will come & I'm keeping my eyes peeled for a better & cheaper rig for you.

HTH,

Ryoko · Mar 4, 2003, 08:25 PM

newer games just need more ram. throw the extra 256 at it and gaming should be fine.
however, if a program needs more than 256mb by itself, win98 just won't cut it.

on the os issue:

*depending on the hardware setup and sheer amount of bootup programs* win98se has been for me much more stable, much faster, and much more tinker friendly than winxp ever has been.

digitalwanderer · Mar 8, 2003, 10:50 AM

Dang it, I have GOT to quit getting emotionally attached to hardware!!!

Me friend is coming by in about 3 hours to pick up/get orientated on his new PC, and I gotta admit that I'm a bit excited as I'm pretty dang proud of the set-up on his rig now. (Hey, it's a schweeeeet rig...it's easy to get it set up well.

)

Let's see:

-win98se/winXP dual-boot, both OS custom tweaked to the gills along with user friendly instructions on maintanence & preference changes & such.

-Photoshop6, OfficeXP, Nero5, SmartFTP, Netscape 3.0,

-Half-life, Soldier of Fortune, GTA3, Mafia, Unreal, Nali Pa, Unreal Tournament, UT2k3, Unreal2, Alice, Star Trek: Elite Forces, The Sims, Jedi Knights, Jedi Knights 2, Medal of Honor, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, No One Lives Forever, NOLF2, Rogue Squadron, Red Faction, Blade of Darkness, Oni, MDK2, AlienVPredator2, Max Payne, and DeusEx

-Lots of "linux keyboard drivers"

-LOTR-TTT & Star Trek Enterprise complete first season.

-Bonus goodies, everything I could think of.

I still gotta install SS & SS:SE on her, but all games are full-installs and fully tweaked and configured. (Not to mention running better than they do on my best rig.

)

All in all, I'm pretty happy with the finished results. I figure it'll keep him busy for a while.

Did I miss anything?

UberLord · Mar 8, 2003, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by digitalwanderer
Netscape 3.0

[size=large][color=red]For the love of god man, get out of the stone-ages !!![/color][/size]

Time to update......