X1000 series: The aftermath

Kombatant · Oct 6, 2005, 11:12 AM

I am interested in seeing your reaction to ATI's latest launch. What do you think of the new cards? Should ATI have done something differently?

Sandok · Oct 6, 2005, 11:23 AM

I have decided to stop posting in anything ATI related... Apparently I'm the anti-neon according to some of the higher classed people

***Zardon*** · Oct 6, 2005, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandok

I have decided to stop posting in anything ATI related... Apparently I'm the anti-neon according to some of the higher classed people

I think you mean you are the "neon of nvidia"

Post your feelings, i mean I doubt there is anyone who has missed them but its a forum, opinions matter!

Kombatant · Oct 6, 2005, 11:32 AM

Exactly

All voices should be heard, that's what "discussion" is all about after all!

Dazog · Oct 6, 2005, 11:38 AM

I will pipe in,

Nvidia has won this round

ATi has been late with Crossfire and with there x1000 series cards.

I wanted to run out and buy one the day they were released.

NOT A CHANCE

Let's hope ATi doesn't mess it up again with the R580 or whatever the refresh will be next year.

Nvidia has raised the bar, I hope Ati doesn't get crushed trying to jump over it.

Sandok · Oct 6, 2005, 11:39 AM

Okay here goes... First, I love ATI... Alot! Now that that's out of the way, here are my opinions.

I love what they've been able to do with the current tech. 16 pipes = 24 pipes. I mean, the whole new processing engine and pipe method is great but at what cost?

Extreme clocks to be competitve. Well that's not good news cuz it's very hot (meaning it's dual slot cooled), it's very long and it's a killer for the PSU. And I can't imagine what ATI will be able to do for it's future line up. They won't be making XT PE versions cuz there doesn't seem to be much left to clock. The 7800 series is low clocked, is single slot, low power compsution (lower than my X850XT PE) so I find it's quite an accomplishement.

Next is the availiblity. ATI has been plagued recently with no Crossfire, no cards. I find their reputation has been spoilt badly and it'll take em some time to get that straighten out. And the reduction on their warrenty is evil. Evil i tell ya.

So is this the amazing card I was expetcing? No. I mean, sure performance is better than the 7800 GTX but still, NVidia is becoming a great allrounder cuz they rule in OpenGL and in DX. But ATI still hasn't gotten their OpenGL on par. Yet. One thing is the drivers on ATI are just a billion times better than NV and I can't wait to see what they can do.

Finally, price. You don't get that much better speeds for the amount you're going to pay more than the 7800 series. So it's not totally worth it. IMHO. And the price on the XT card is going to SKYROCKET since it will never appear.

So what do I make out of all this? Is it a failure? No but it ain't a win. Far from it. I think NV has the top hand again (mobile is back with them, desktop imho, etc...) They really played their cards well. I just hope that ATI STOPS trying to copy NV now and they really push it for the R580

***temeteus82*** · Oct 6, 2005, 11:51 AM

Anyone read THG's preview of X1K series???

http://graphics.tomshardware.com/gra...006/index.html

pj.morgan · Oct 6, 2005, 12:10 PM

Heres my thoughts:

After the inital delay, having to wait another month for availablity is annoying. Although until NV raised the bar this was considered the norm, so you have to say hats off to them for that.

Performance is good, but not really any better than NV GTX, NV has their card available now, and at a cheaper price. In the UK the X1800XT is �420, thats about �100 more than a GTX. I'm an ATI fan, but for the first time in years I have actually considered buying an NV card.

When all the reviews appeared yesterday, I went through them all specifically looking for an overclocking section. Is it me or did no one oc the cards? If these cards oc'd well that would swing things back in favour for me, anyone got a link to an oc review?

The only other thing going for ATI at the moment is the work Terry does here for the community, which in my eyes is a big plus...I can't imagine NV ever doing that, or putting themselves out for people the way Terry does.

I think I'll wait for someone to get an X1800XT on decent cooling (water / aftermarket air) and see how she clocks, if its a no go then I think I will sit this one out and wait for R580....I bet shes not the usual 6 months away.

Kombatant · Oct 6, 2005, 12:27 PM

What ATI did wrong (especially with the Euro sites) was that reviewers had 2 days to bench ALL of the cards, which imo is unacceptable. Ask our Veridian3 at what lengths he went to in order to bring us these benchmarks. And still, in such a short period of time, you can't possibly test everything.

dipstick · Oct 6, 2005, 12:31 PM

Honestly I think the whole lineup is excellent but they need to get them out the door asap. It's getting very tiresome to want something new but not being able to find it or if you do its priced $400 over msrp. IQ is one thing ATI has always had over nVidia but its gotten to the point where its not worth waiting for. For those that decided to wait on upgrading there is nothing to be dissatisfied with, the cards simply burn through even the highest resolutions with the best IQ out there. Those who took the plunge with the 7800's should also be very happy as their cards are still going blow for blow with ATi's latest. If ATi can deliver the goods they will have great success with the new lineup.

ronnn · Oct 6, 2005, 02:09 PM

I think that the launch went relatively poorly. Ati is still obviously having problems getting cards out the door. For some insane reason I believe that they are coming on mass - as production issues are somewhat fixed. With a first driver set, these cards performed amazingly well and with refinements - both in construction (coolers) and drivers - they will start to steal the show. Most new tech tends to catch up to their 3dmark scores as drivers mature. My prediction is that by Christmas the pressure will be on Nvidia to catch up, but until than will be dark days for Ati. In terms of performance the x1800xl and xt are something I would like. Just not too quickly, as I just bought my x800xtpe refurb late this summer. Ok I am biased, as Ati cards have treated me very well and the x800xtpe has just worked and games look and play great.

riles9262 · Oct 6, 2005, 04:46 PM

I think that the higher end cards are fine, although late. However, I think that the midrange/lowrange cards, where the majority of the market is, are severely lacking. The 1600 and 1300 are priced too highly to compete with their said competitors; I mean who'd really choose a 1300 when a 6600gt is available at the same price? Lastly, a late launch means that oem systems (with current technology) have gone with nvidia instead, and that's a huge chunk of market that's hard to recover.

Dyre Straits · Oct 6, 2005, 08:42 PM

IMHO there is NO launch until the product is actually available. I fail to see why there's so much hype about a product that can only be read about online. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of ATi's products, but, this just doesn't cut it.

pr0digal jenius · Oct 6, 2005, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riles9262

Lastly, a late launch means that oem systems (with current technology) have gone with nvidia instead, and that's a huge chunk of market that's hard to recover.

bingo

Ping_of_HG · Oct 6, 2005, 11:02 PM

This thread is a no brainer. As stated by others above, ATI is trying to get up from a beat down position.

It really comes down to a few basic points.

-ATI didn't deliver on time.
-ATI's newest is hotter, bigger & more expensive.
-ATI's are slower (right now).
-ATI's Crossfire is a underperforming pipe dream (at this time).

-Nvidia's cards (7800GT/GTX) are the opposite(& cheaper) than the above.
-Nvidia's cards are all SLI and motherboards are easy to come by.