am i parinoid about posting un-copywrited songs?

Toadly_Ossum · Jul 7, 2005, 01:05 PM

I have a few original songs that Im really proud of and would like to post and contribute to any kX sampler cds, but after playing them to some of my local friends they said "your crazy if you post that on the web, someone will steal your song!" Im unsure how to go about geting my original music copywrited, or if Im just being parinoid. Any thoughts?

Toad

Maddogg6 · Jul 7, 2005, 06:59 PM

First.
In the US - Copyrights are immediate and inferred. to a point.

Then....
The way I see it is this...

If your good, and made a good song and some one steals it.

There are several points to make:
A - you need $$ to pay a lawyer to enforce your protections (like for a seize and desist order)
B - You need to pay (again) a lawyer to take offenders to court. Not to mention the actual collecting of damages/due royalties. Ooops don't forget court fees - you may not win and you'll have to pay them too.
C - Their lawyers are probably probably better than yours.
D - They (the ones most likely to capitalize on others work) get a salery to play this legal game, most of us do not. How can you compete?

Point is. Copyrights are only effective if you already have money to enforce protections. If you have plenty money - skip the legal shit and head for the marketing department.

Otherwise, if someone takes your 'IDEAS' and makes them 'Marketable' - IMHO its your loss for not having that aspect of the business covered. Remember the music indusrty is NOT JUST ABOUT MUSIC - its MORE about image, money and politics.

but thats just one dumb ass' opinion tho.

I hope for the day when some guy approaches me and says - ' Ya know that song you made up - now dont get mad, but I made $5M on it, I spent it all and I need another to support my lifestyle. I need your help.'

I'm not even worried about his first $5M - because if he has the inside track, I can write plenty more. If my stuff was in that caliber to begin with.

**dj_stick** · Jul 7, 2005, 08:02 PM

Toadly_Ossum:
you should be safe as long as you can prove you wrote the song, with digital music it makes life easier, if you have the original project file from your sequencer, where as the other party only has hte end result - evidence points to you as the original artist

TravelRec. · Jul 9, 2005, 03:49 AM

Here in Germany there is a way to save your material as your own stuff if you send yourself a registered letter with the lyrics and partiture or digital media included. You have to store this letter then closed on a save place. If someone steals you material you can take your letter and go to a lawyer, so you can prove (with the stamp of the post-office) that you have the copyright of the material to a given date and that you are the first one. If the thief cannot show such a letter or similar, the right is on your side. He has to pay the lawyers cost and maybe some bucks for stealing your stuff.
About the samplers: You can trust in me that I never reproduce any of your stuff, this is not my intention!

ROBSCIX · Jul 9, 2005, 01:35 PM

That registered letter idea is a good one I'll have to remember that.

Maddogg6 · Jul 9, 2005, 05:39 PM

Send registered and get a receipt - the USPO NORMAL datestamps are NOT official and *could* raise doubt as it could *possibly* be forged.
The receipt from the post-office as given with registered letters holds way more 'legal water'.

In the US - THE best way to prove the date of creation is by submitting to the USPTO its relativly in-expensive and if you REALLY worried its the best thing to do. Even if your in another country, foriegn entities CAN file and enjoy those protections at least in the US.

But, for me I still think I'd be wasting my money.

Smurf43 · Nov 24, 2005, 03:31 AM

Mailing a letter to yourself will not hold up in court, no matter what you hear......I just went thru it and it don't work...your friends and anyone who tells you this is flat out wrong!

In the USA pay the money and file with the Library of Congress, join ASCAP or BMI (or the one from Canada) and USE THE © ON EVERYTHING YOU WRITE I also am using the Creative Commons License now until songs go thru the Library of Congress......

If we don't protect yourself we get what we deserve.

trevbushell · Nov 29, 2005, 10:45 AM

so maybe we should all remove our songs from this and other sites to stop them from being plaguerised (or however you spell it!)??

Maddogg6 · Nov 29, 2005, 12:57 PM

While smurf is absolutly right -

Its relatively easy to make small changes and it be 'different enough' - AND you have to hire a lawyer to order to 'seize and desist' then litigate ($$$$ and you *could* still loose) remeber - they (those who would benefit most from stolen works) have a large budget for legal defense... Most of us dont.

remeber 'Vanilla Ice' v Queen 'Under Pressure' case a few years back. This case just about quantified how much something needs to be different to be 'original' - and it boiled down to 1 note out of a phrase ( or rest as I recall actually).

So EVEN when you take ALL steps of protecting your self - its still can happen anyway. If you want to share your creation with others that is.

If ONLY you hear it, no one else can steal i it right? ... Its the only way to fully protect yourself from theft. Which IMHO is too extreme. I equate it to - never buy a car, because it could be stolen. But then again, I never tried surfing in fear of being bit by sharks... so, we choose our fates by the risks we are willing to take in life.

trevbushell · Nov 29, 2005, 02:40 PM

yep i would agree with you maddog... totally. thats why i have all my music here on the forum, so people can listen and maybe it'll touch someone? if it does then im happy.

i write because i enjoy the process and its immensly satisfying but my main hope is that people listen and enjoy it and that motivates me. so the more people that listen the better.

if someone wants to abuse my music to their own financial benefit then thats their problem. i wouldnt be happy but i guess its the price we pay for sharing something and trusting people. like you say we could lead very safe comfortable lives in our fortresses and never get hurt... but boy we'd die of boredom and i for one prefer to take risks.

they say "the graveyard is the richest place on earth!!". why? Because so many ideas, dreams, songs, books and talents are buried there that are never realised! I for one am gonna make sure i dont take anything with me into the graveyard! i would agree with you maddog wholeheartedly.. lifes too short!

btw- i surf and its AMAZING!! havent been eaten alive yet! lol

Smurf43 · Dec 3, 2005, 06:24 AM

The post I made before is what happened with the last band I was in, and it was a royal pain to go thru.

My tunes are up for anyone to listen to, perform, etc. just not use in a commercial setting. I still copyright, and use the Creative Commons bit, but like you said, if they want it, unless you have a ton of money, they will get it!

Hugh Crain · Jan 23, 2006, 05:13 AM

Copyright works best. Anyone with "deep pockets" who actually steals your music will no doubt settle out of court by purchasing the rights if you have a decent amount of evidence that you are the author of the song. Lawyers will work for you for 1/3 of the recovery plus expenses.

radiocolonel.it · Jan 23, 2006, 10:44 AM

...that's obvious! In every aspect of life having money makes things easier...
money gives u power... rights.... women....
because if u don't have the above things... u can buy them, if u got money!

trevbushell · Jan 23, 2006, 05:26 PM

it doesnt give you happiness though!! proven by many rich people who are very unhappy!
trev

Maddogg6 · Jan 24, 2006, 12:53 AM

Ive read 'Money doesnt buy you happiness'

I also read 'At least you can choose your misery'

Theres 2 sides to just about every coin -

Not that Im materialistic - the DAMN stores & government is..